Dave Mac Recovered From A 30 Year Old Stroke With The Carnivore Diet!

welcome to the plant free MD podcast with Dr Anthony chafee where we discuss diet and nutrition and how this affects health and chronic disease and show you how you can use this to optimize your health and happiness both mentally and physically hey everyone it's Dr Anthony chafee here again with another episode of the plant free MDU podcast and today I have a very special guest guest goes by Dave Mack and Dave thank you very much for for coming on that's a has a podcast the no carb life or zero carb on YouTube and many people may be familiar with his work so Dave thank you very much for joining me welcome no thank you thank you very much for having me Anthony I appreciate it yeah you're very welcome so for people who haven't come across your podcast you can tell us a bit about yourself and what you do sure so um I'm uh I'm a 48 year old guy Australian guy living in Japan and um I uh I had a bit of success uh over the last nine months with the carnivore diet and after I started to have that success probably about three months in I was so excited about it that I wanted to post and you know kind of tell everyone hey Hang on we're doing it wrong we're doing this diet wrong we should be you know eating eating more meat and uh so that's kind of where the the channel started from so yeah oh very good so what brought you to um a carnivore diet in the first place so basically what happened is um June 3 last year I saw my doctor and he gave me some bad news he told me that I was likely pre-diabetic and um I was also drinking way way way too much which I already knew but it was kind of shocking to hear my doctor say it and he wanted to put me on a special drug that made you physically ill if you had any alcohol the drugs called antabuse and I that really kind of shocked me into okay I need to I need to kind of take charge of this and so that led me to um keto I've done keto before I've done low carb I I did Atkins way back originally in like 2000. and um so I thought you know this this diet whenever I've done it before I always feel like I've got a lot of self-control and you know giving up alcohol self-control is the thing I need so I went on the keto diet and started changing my my routines and habits and um I got out of alcohol um and I was doing pretty I I was doing all right but um I was experiencing stomach upsets and I was spending longer in the bathroom than I wanted to be so um I I started looking around and um you know trying to work out what was going on because I hadn't experienced it before when I done Atkins or keto in the past and it I found I think it was a video by Ken Berry and he was talking about how particular um vegetables uh cause different reactions but um one of those is uh gastro gastrointestinal upsets and the vegetables he was describing were ones that I was eating so it was like red peppers and yellow peppers and stuff like that and I was eating these because it was like if I mix this in with the the meat and the eggs that I'm eating you know this is going to give you the vitamin C that I need you know and um so I thought okay well he's saying that this is probably causing the problems that I'm having so I'm going to give this up for a while and see what happens and I gave it up and of course it stopped and I've just been carnivore ever since very good so um one of the sort of the helper obviously some GA issues uh resolve but what else did you notice that you went on to a full carnivore diet um first uh the first thing that I noticed was improved sleep so just some general things that I that I had noticed on low carb before like improved sleep and stuff like that but the there's many things that I can talk about but the biggest thing was um improvements in um kind of body functions that I have that were an issue for me because of a stroke I had 30 years ago so um I was 17 I had a stroke and um after that it happened I um I've just for 30 years I've lived with balance issues you know issues walking um issues with strength on my right hand side um generally coordination like walking up and down stairs it was always a nightmare not that I couldn't do it but like I was always kind of fearful I'm gonna fall you know and um so I always kind of would make sure that the handrail was close to my left side you know because my left side is the side that now even though I'm right-handed my left side is where I would react quickly so if something happens so you know if I did tumble or slip or something I knew that if my left hand's near the handrail I'm I'm probably going to be all right um and you know since I've been on the carnivore diet I don't even think about that anymore I've got no I've I've of course have still got a weakening on my right side but um I don't have the balance issues anymore I like I run down the stairs I can go up the stairs two at a time things like that I don't have to worry about a handrail you know it's just it's life-changing yeah that's amazing too that you had this this stroke you know 30 years ago and neurological issues since then and then nine months on a carnivore diet and all of a sudden you know 30 years of of neurological issues are gone that's absolutely amazing it's great to hear hey guys just want to take a second to thank our sponsor the carnivore bar I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat for those times that you're out hiking road tripping or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat fat and salt if you want it the carnivore bar is a great option so I like this product not because it's just pure meat but also because I want the carnivore Market to thrive as well and the more we support meat only products the more meat only products there will be available in the mainstream so if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10 off which also applies to subscriptions giving you 25 off total all right thanks guys yeah and it feels like you know it feels like it's not just an improvement that's happened and that's it it feels like this is gradually continuing to get better you know um because every day I kind of notice like oh I never used to be able to walk well walk or run this fast I never it's been so long since I felt up this power like um running is is something that you know I can't even even in high school I don't think I could run as you know fast or um with this with as much kind of staying power as I can now okay yeah well something to obviously you know some more economic hemorrhages or or devastating about a third of them are fatal and um a lot of other people are left with permanent neurological impairment but apparently not necessarily permanent apparently there is some room for improvement even after 30 years I'm I'm really um really impressed by that I think that's absolutely fantastic normally people would think that the amount of healing that your your brain and nervous system can do basically reaches uh you know a certain level and then after two years or so what healing can be done is done and that's just sort of what you have to live with after that you can do you know Physical Therapy you know therapy to optimize your situation but it generally is is learning how to live with a situation as opposed to improving it much more than that and so that is very reassuring and very encouraging for people that are suffering from neurological impairments or neurological deficits due to some sort of stroke or injury so hopefully there are people out there listening that can be encouraged to take that up and see how it goes yeah yeah um it's I I as I say like the it is life-changing I mean for someone who hasn't been through that kind of thing it's hard to go well your balance is better or whatever you know it might seem like a small thing but you know when you when you struggle to put you know you struggle to put your sock on your right foot uh sorry on your left foot because you can't balance properly on your right foot um it's uh you know and now it's a lot easier I mean it's just it's hard to describe how much that you know means you know yeah absolutely so you um I think you you when we were discussing an email you said that you've done sort of Keto Atkins previously um I wonder you know and so that would have been after the the subarachnoid hemorrhage um did you notice any improvements in your neurological function just with the the keto Atkins sort of thing or was it not really until you like full carnivore that you you noticed that yeah I didn't notice kind of thing um like the improvements in the neurological side um yeah that was just after full Carnival oh interesting yeah because um obviously being in ketosis you know the ketones actually help uh you know can can help build the structural components of the brain having more and that were you like heavily meat based sort of Keto Atkins sort of thing or or I I was okay um well so so let me I I was relatively but I was I was making up a lot of I've I found that my Association came a lot from eating like stuff like cheese and whatever so I spent a lot of time I I ate a lot of cheese and I was young and I didn't really care about what nutrition was in it I was just like oh I'm losing weight I feel happy um but uh even the meat that I was eating tended to be more chicken base so it wasn't it wasn't really fatty mates you know I'm I I because I I don't like fatty chicken so okay yeah yeah it's interesting um yeah you talked about other podcasts uh key tells me how high Ketone levels you know they can cross a blood-brain barrier and then reconstitute to fatty acids which are able to be used as building blocks in the brain and cholesterol and other other fats are used to myelinate the the nerve axons and you know this helps people in a lot of ways and the Brain just works better running on ketones also so you can see a lot of those potential areas of improvement uh but and so I think it's it's very interesting that you know that it was even more so that there was something else just getting rid of the plants you know even though he had had to be maybe eating as much fat uh but there was something to do with combination of maybe more fat more cholesterol but also just eliminating these these different plants that maybe have been holding you back or or causing a bit of disturbances as well so that's very interesting um so you you mentioned as well that you know when you started doing uh your videos that that you sort of sort of like hey you know maybe we're not maybe people aren't doing carnivore uh quite right can you can you talk a bit about that what you what you sort of notice and what you say I I I'm sorry uh what I what I meant to say was like uh you know more more in terms of we've been misled about this nutrition all our lives you know you know stop it's not the grains that we should be eating it's the uh you know it's the meat and stuff like that that's what I was just so excited about it you know because in the past when I have done something like Atkins or keto or although the the stretch the the space of time that I've done it has never been as long as this um I I've always given it up because it's been something like you know someone will say something to me that's like you shouldn't be doing this you know you need your bread you need your grains you need your rice whatever it is um you know uh when I first did Atkins there was um I mean you're in Australia you know a show are called a current affair yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it used to be on around 6 30 or something right and it's real kind of tabloidy journalism right it's like what can we say that's just gonna get everyone to watch you know um and back in 2000 when I did Atkins it was like every day for some they they realized Atkins was becoming popular and um every day was something about how you you're gonna die from having this diet you know and um so it was just the pressure's always been too much and I've given up before you know and that was another thing that really kind of drove me to no I've got to be the other boys out there getting the word out about it yeah but that's good so you decided that you just sort of sort of fed up with things and uh and and started to speak out what are some of the topics that you that you can cover um you know uh things like um just the improvements that I've experienced but also um I try to do live streams occasionally so that you know I can connect with other people that are doing it or maybe considering it but um the other thing is for me um I've always understood medical things or scientific things more easily when when I can look at them as an analogy to something else and so I I've been watching a lot of other people's videos like your videos and Paul Mason's videos and and um you know other people like that and you all do a really good job of explaining things but you know as you're explaining the way particular things work as it's going into my head I'm always kind of thinking what's the analogy to something that I know and just sales or to this or to that you know how can I how can I remember this more easily I stole my videos on my channel are also kind of you know explaining the same kind of things that say you or Paul Mason might explain but just putting into some analogy that I understand hoping that I can maybe get the message across more easily to someone else yeah I'm sorry going I didn't mean to cut you both I was just going to give an example like for example you know talking about an LDL cholesterol or something like that you know yeah well I mean and that's and that's the the really important thing about having you know a lot of voices out there is that you know the way that you explain things to people may really resonate with with many people that maybe they look at my stuff and go like okay I'm not really getting this or maybe it sounds good but it but it really hits home you know when you say it and I think that's so important I you know as I mentioned before we we started the recording I you know I was hesitant to even start a channel just because I thought that there were enough voices out there there were enough people like you know Dr Sean Baker and others that were and you know Ken vary and things like that that were saying the things that I thought should be said more important to be said um and there was you know certain things that I like focusing on and so I'd been on Dr Baker's podcast very early on and other people and found me through that and you know I like to talk about certain things in the context of you know plants being you know Toxic by nature and us being carnivores by nature and and those things don't really get along too well and so you know I I thought that maybe it wouldn't be you know that there was a saturated sort of um you know that the market was already saturated and maybe I didn't need to you know add in anything maybe I didn't really have much to add but you know when I when I did go in and I just started sort of saying these things in the way that I fit I thought uh was easy for me to understand you know people you know like that said hey you know I like the way you're doing that too so that that worked out so I it's great that you know you then took that and then said okay and then how would I best understand because people do think about things differently and you know the ways that that you think about things and you portray things that's going to really resonate with people more so than than my stuff or Dr Baker's stuff or Dr Barry's stuff and so I think it's really good and also I just think it's it's so important to have more and more and more people like yourself coming out and myself and everyone else that's saying hey this works for me this is why I think it works this is what I well I think it will work for other people and getting more and more voices out there so we can just sort of overwhelm the vegan voices because there's like 9 000 of these people you know every day on the vegan influencer side of things that are you know really pushing this and it really is persuasive persuading a lot of people to try this and then things like the game changers you know why Factor you know that thing that came out um you know it's it's changing a lot of a lot of hearts and minds and I think we really need a lot of people to get on this side because there's only a few people that it's just like ah it's just a couple whack jobs you can just you can just ignore them but you know we get more and more and more people out there then they have to at least you know address it you know and now you're starting to see on on different news outlets or you know whatever people then saying like oh this carnivore diet this is crazy and at least having to address it and call it crazy whereas before they could just see Nora but now they can't there's too many of us now and there's the you know we're doing it yeah that's what I noticed I mean recently like channels like um there I can't remember the name of there's a vegan Channel that I reviewed one of their videos um a couple of weeks ago and that channel recently has been putting out a lot of videos saying carnivore is dumb kind of or is this kind of or is that and it I I get the feeling like they feel like there's a pressure to say something which probably in the past they may not have you know they're just uh we just ignore it it's just a fringe kind of thing you know um and you know I guess you could take you could look at it two ways you could look at it negatively or the disincarnable but I think the positive way to look at it is that means it's becoming more mainstream yeah absolutely I was in a sequent uh you know Dr Paul Mason several months ago and you know talking about you know how you know the growth of the carnivore movement and uh you know I said that you know I think it still had a long way to go but I was hoping that you know in years in the next sort of five years it would be quite mainstream and and he's saying you think it's getting bigger I was like you know I think I think it is he's just like I don't know I think we're we might just be in an echo chamber and we're just talking to like-minded people and it seems like there's more of us out there but um but I do I do think that it's growing because you know I I first of all I've had two patients in the emergency department that I'm reviewing for Neurosurgical cases recognizing and and start you know one person is like you know what to say um excuse me um do you only eat meat by any chance I'm like yeah like why do you ask and you know he just you know he followed me on Instagram and YouTube was like oh I really like your channel I really like your videos and that's something that I've that I've been been trying out I'm like wow that's great uh one gentleman who actually um was in with us with a brain tumor uh and I had been I hadn't been there I hadn't met this gentleman and uh and I came and ran in on the rounds and he was looking at me like he knew me and I was like just trying to wreck my brand I was like how I met this guy and um and so it was just doing the morning rounds and just seeing how he was doing and I just sort of switched back from another hospital so I literally had not been in that hospital for months and so I really couldn't have met this guy and he was like oh Dr chafee it's really nice to see you and I was just what you know and he'd seen my interview with uh Professor Thomas Seyfried specifically talking about glioblastoma brain cancers and so he was just like yeah I'm I'm gonna get on that like I'm doing that I watch your secret thing I was just like oh okay um that's amazing so I think I think it is getting bigger and a while and and you know more and more um and I think and I think a big part of that too is is largely through the Q movement as well because that that has a large fan base already it's been around for decades and so now the keto group is now recognizing Hey Arnold's a type of Keto and and you know and and and maybe there's something to that as well you know we get rid of cars we get rid of sugar but now getting rid of more things maybe that's good too and that's why you know when I got invited to speak at ketocon my talk was about that like say hey we've made this huge step getting rid of carbs and sugar you know we need to go one more step forward and say and recognize that there are more things that are bad it's not just carbohydrates and and that seemed to have been uh you know taken well as well so how do you how do you find that do you find that it's getting more and more attraction yeah I mean even like the the thing I feel is like people see this and they they realize I've tried keto before and I stuck to it but then I went you know I fell off the wagon and whatever and hang on this this thing is like keto but it means I can eat more more of what I like and less of what I don't like you know I don't have to have those bitter vegetables anymore no more spinach for me and um you know and I can still get my vitamin C you know let's go I'm gonna try it and they see results like that you know like um honestly like someone I interviewed on my channel the other day he his results are kind of like I mean his results have been more extreme but his his results have been kind of like the way I the way I did things you know he started the carnivore diet he got these awesome results and he's like I need to start a YouTube channel and tell people about this you know there and he's like um you know three months and he's lost 60 pounds you know and um you know he feels better than ever he's ever felt in his life you know so it's just everyone sees it they go oh you know I've tried something like this I'll give it a try to get results and they're just like yeah I mean I mean yeah yeah and uh well that's great well hopefully he does make a YouTube channel I mean you know the more the merrier really I um I don't know I get it's um yeah I don't think I don't think of it as like like competition like that's sort of a weird thought I want this to grow I want as you eat people as possible to be talking about this and to have YouTube channels and to talk about their success and talk about their Journey it's really powerful you know there's some one of the most influential documentaries that that affected the health space in in recent years um what was it was it like that sick and nearly dead or something like that um green smoothies and things like that and um and he worked with uh Dr Furman who yeah really pushes just you know vegan diet sort of things but what this guy did you know lose a lot of weight and came off a lot of medications and things like that really what he did is he is he went to a more Whole Food diet and he did like a bunch of juice smoothies he was eating Whole Food he was cooking he wasn't eating processed garbage he wasn't drinking alcohol smoking things like that so he lost a lot of weight gained a lot of health and he went around talking to different people and you could see him in real time Getting Thinner and healthier and he was just drinking these smoothies and eating you know home-cooked meals and talking to people and just getting better and better and better and healthier and healthier and that that left a big impact on people and so I think that the more people that actually document their you know their their experience with it especially from the start especially if they're you know early on and they're like hey you know what I'm just gonna you know see what this does for me and they you know see this transformation I think that's very very powerful so hopefully more and more yeah and so the the thing is as well you know like everyone walking around with the smartphone in their pocket right most people have got a lot of pictures of themselves in the past and a lot of videos of themselves in the past and so you know it's it's a lot easier when you've if you find you've suddenly lost the weight because you tried this carnivore diet it's good it's easy now to go back and go what did I look like before and you can show people see look that's what I was like you know yeah yeah and you know that's what I was able to do on my channel even with the walking you know I was able to do a side by side with the walking because um you know just occasionally when I'm walking with my daughter my wife on video video recorded right so I was able to go oh that's what I was like before this is what I'm like walking now you know oh very good yeah yeah right and that's that's gonna be very powerful how's the response to uh those sorts of videos where you're showing your actual improvements ah really good and you know the the surprising thing is when I first talked about it um and that's uh I I just had so many comments on my channel from other people who have had Strokes that have seen massive improvements um by doing a keto or kind of what diet yeah and then you imagine that oh sorry no go ahead I was saying you mentioned um you did a response to one of the vegan videos what uh if I'm asked what was that about what did you what were they talking about um so so the thumbnail was kind of you know it worked on me it was intentionally inflammatory and so I watched it and the carnivore the the thumbnail just said something like carnivorism is dumb you know and then the title the title was another doctor says carnivore is dumb or something like that and so it was an interview with um with Garth Davis no no I mean he's a bariatric surgeon and uh I'm aware of him we we had it had on uh Instagram you know like two years ago or something like that uh yeah he's an absolute tool I'm just gonna throw that on the person he was just he was just he certainly in in the interview I mean he comes off as the least genuine person you will ever see like he's it's as if in the video he is just thinking who's my audience how do I have to answer these questions like he's not answering from the heart he's not answering from what just he's experienced he's just thinking what do these people want to hear um yeah and so yeah that was the one I I um I reviewed because some of the things he said is just like carnivorism is dumb it's anti-intellectual I don't know why we're even giving this the time of day there's no studies on it and I was thinking well hang on where are your studies yeah you know it's you know um he just yeah he just seemed to be playing to the crowd yeah so he's he's a he's um yeah bariatric surgeon so he does he does uh weight loss surgery and uh and he espouses a vegan diet and what I what I asked him was if your diet works so well why do you have to do surgery on people right you know if you're a very good question yeah you know but that but the fact is you know it doesn't help but it doesn't it doesn't help people makes them very sick and it's hard for them to eat and uh you know especially with this bariatric surgery now the stomach small you've mutilated someone they actually causes huge problems uh my sister had had bariatric surgery and she had enormous problems with that she became very vitamin deficient she got a stricture she couldn't eat she was vomiting she had surgery she um you know she was she was very very sick and and the and the nutritionist um it was telling her just just whatever you do just get as many calories you have to get calories just just you know drink soda just eat sugar or whatever you love like Jesus what this is like you know you're one person just yeah you know obviously went and got you know surgery because they were having difficulty with their weight and now you're telling them to do to eat as as poorly as possible they're going to get worse you know uh eating it's out of it like what is you and um so obviously that wasn't Garth Davis and Davey's uh nutritionist but um yeah so you know I asked him that was just like you know what you know if your diet works so well why do you have to do surgery because the fact of the matter is I have patients that uh you know if you if you have a leptin over 100 you know bariatric surgeons will say you cannot lose weight you have to get surgery and yet putting them on a carnivore diet their leptin comes down their weight comes down and their health issues reverse I've had I had a patient whose leptin was nearly 200. you know they lost they lost tons of weight and they're left in just just comes right down they did not need surgery just to just to clarify leptin's the one that makes you feel hungry is that right oh no that that's growing yeah so uh leptin's the one that makes you feel satiated exactly yeah and it's uh so is it from your stretch receptors and sort of you know when your stomach's full you know send off leptin and that's what I said oh you should touch a fiber because it it makes it hits your stretch receptors and it sends off leptin and you get satiated you feel like you've eaten a lot but you actually didn't get anything because there's no calories in it so it's like you know it's to trick your body into thinking you've eaten something it's like yeah you're not actually going to trick millions of years of evolution like you're just not that smart and if you were smart you would just what it's supposed to have and follow our biology and evolution and and this biological design rather than try and fool around with it that's just silly um but yeah so so that guy there you can see um so we got we hadn't had this back and forth and he and he was just an obnoxious twit but what really uh you know uh told me everything that I needed to know about the guy was that I was absolutely just stomping him down on every single argument on all the all the questions it was just like this guy couldn't get it get um get a point past me and um and and this was on someone else's thread it was also a complete twit um no doubski and and he's just an idiot he's he's just the one of these calories in calories out guys it just does nothing matters except calories and calories out I was like well calories are different idiot you know maybe you should have learned that in Biochemistry you know that these aren't actually just you know we don't we're not a calorimeter we don't just like burn things we're not even have an internal combustion engine you know these are complex bio organic molecules that have complex bioorganic uh you know interactions with the rest of our our molecules and chemicals in our body you know we're a giant chemistry set with trillions of uh cells and trillions of uh molecules in each of those cells so there's extraordinarily complex and just boiling it down to calories is just insane because these things in specific interactions and there's so much more to it than that so he's just he's just uh not very smart but so it was on that and he was like trying to like you know get get all his little supporters to try to come after me so I was I was happy for the challenge I was just going after I was going I was like just debating like 12 people at a time in this one thread and and Davey's uh you know was foolish enough to jump in on that as well and I was just slapping him down because he had nothing what he was saying had any Merit whatsoever and so knowing that he was losing what he did was he blocked me so that I couldn't see his responses so it looked like he wasn't responding anymore and then he was he was responding like I didn't respond like yeah that's right you don't have anything you have no comeback for that because blah blah blah oh really I had a I had another sort of alternate um page and uh and so I was able to always like hold on a second so I went in there and looked at that I saw because someone was saying it's like oh yeah you didn't have to respond to that I'm like what are you talking about like he didn't say anything and so I went in the other one and I saw I was just like oh what a little loser and so then like and that counts it's like hey you know this is my alternate alternate account you're a coward you know you know and it's like this is the response to all that and um yeah and so he and nodalski tried that they tried like you know blocking me and then like responding to me like yeah that's right you know like after they blocked me so I had my alternative account go in there and you know pick up the fight you know and just to keep going so that yeah they're absolute cowards and they they don't know what they're talking about the thing is is like well why are we even talking about this it's like well you're not talking about this you're running from this like you have no you know stakenness like you haven't had any sort of actual uh you know formidable debate with anyone I mean I I trashed these guys in the comments I had no YouTube this is years ago I had no no YouTube channel or anything like that I just you know knew a lot more than them and you know and they um you know they couldn't even handle that so the fact that you know the chance of them actually having a debate or discussion with anybody who like it's publicly known that they have something to say like there's not a chance that they'll go anywhere near that absolute cowards and because they know they're they're I don't know if they know that they're wrong but they know they're going to lose and that should be good enough they should really reevaluate their entire life yeah choices here if they if they if they cannot support their own uh decision their own life choices like maybe they need to reevaluate their merits right uh it's kind of scary that um people that you trust with your life like someone is going to do bariatric surgery on you is running around like a junior high school kid you know just go you said you were but what am I yeah or whatever you just said I am but what are you or whatever yeah um and I mean the the other thing the calories in calories out is just something that I find crazy I'm not a scientist I'm not a doctor but I even I can look at that and go hang on a calorie of assuming the cat calories even mattered a calorie of chocolate is very different to a calorie of beef or even a calorie of uh a piece of pumpkin or something they're all different surely your body's not going to go oh it's I don't care whether it's chocolate or or bacon or whatever it is I'm just going to treat it the same way it just doesn't make sense no and and then it and it's it doesn't it doesn't treat these things you know there's all sorts of different chemicals in it it's so strange to me how anyone can can buy that I mean first of all when your insulin goes up when you're eating carbohydrates your insulin goes up that just it completely rearranges your biochemistry and your metabolism and puts you into an entirely different metabolic state so to go to medical school in America you have to go through different prerequisites and you have to take biochemistry you have to take senior level um university level biochemistry it's an entire year of course I mean when I took it it was it was it was 460 so that's the highest level um you know course you take as a senior in in college here and you have to do a year of organic chemistry you're inorganic chemistry in order to just qualify to take and a bunch of biology classes to just qualify to take biochemistry so you need a lot of scientific background and then you take this the the biochemistry and then you learn that you have entirely you learn about the different metabolic States you learn about how these different products how differently they were and then to just completely ignore that and just be like bad doesn't matter it doesn't matter what it does it changes your entire metabolism how can that not matter and it when your insulin goes up it derails everything your entire uh metabolic system and it you know in layman's terms put you into a fat storage metabolism whereas you used to be in a fat burning metab so how can that not be significant and there have been studies that showed that when in ketosis you your basal metabolic rate goes up by 300 kilocalories a day so you will burn 300 more calories a day you'll utilize your inner more calories a day and you won't be storing all these calories also so let's say it's just calories and calories obviously these things have a nutritional value they have an energy component along with that and so you know in excess yes you're going you're going to stores I mean your body does store some of these things for a rainy day of course it does but to say it's just that's it just one to one is is so utterly simplistic and first of all you know if you're eating carbohydrates your basal metabolic rate goes down right because insulin's going up and that's slow and when your insulin goes up your metabolism goes down right so you're burning less calories so if it is calories and calories out well how do you calculate that you need you need like a lot of you know heavy uh you know sophisticated equipment from the lab you're not just going to guess this you're not just going to figure this out with like you know some cold scale or something like that um you know and so you know depending on the things that you're eating you're going to put out more calories you're going to use more calories you're going to use more energy um and so depending on what you're eating and how much you're eating if you eat less that can chronically you can slow down your metabolism as well because you show yourself you tell yourself hey we're in a famine we're not getting as much food as we need as your body goes more slow it down we don't want to die we don't want to run out of our stores and even Garth Davis will know because this is this is taught and told in from bariatric uh surgery clinics they tell patients you have to eat at least 1200 calories a day or you will not lose weight because your metabolism will shut down and will go down so low that you eating less calories will actually make you put on fat okay there I thought it was calories and calories out okay well maybe it is calories and calories out but your calories out just went way down because you weren't taking it putting enough calories in so explain that one Garth foreign these are these are just silly to me I mean I I agree with you I think that they're uh entirely too simplistic and just it you just start scratching at the service and you start thinking like this is there's nothing close to something as simple as just calories and calories out that is just never gonna happen I think part of the problem is like over the years maybe not so much now but over the years the public has generally wanted simple explanations to things and the food manufacturers and and other people that benefit from the public wanting those simple things um are just too happy to provide it you know and calories in calories out is a very simplistic way of looking at things so you know that's easy for the public to digest or all fats are bad rather than trans fats are bad is much easier for people to think about you know and so the Food Industries are more than happy to tell people that you know yeah well you know it is easy I can I can boil it Down Easy just eat meat pretty simple yeah yeah and then don't eat plants you know and um yeah I mean there's a lot of there's a lot of uh harmful things in the world there's a lot of harmful things for us to eat there's a lot of things that can cause arm carbohydrates are some of those different toxins but you can boil that down too because basically all all the powerful things to eat are implants and fungus and outside of the Animal Kingdom so you know you can you can boil things down easy it's just it's just parsing it out in the right in the right context I think it's simple when you when you look at you know our biology and uh and what we're biologically designed to eat and and once you get that once you figure that out it is simple you know food is is sent to a koala it knows what food is it just eats that Elliptis and that's it same with a panda and bamboo or a lion and uh and a gazelle you know it knows what food is and so once you understand what food is things get so much more simple you know it's it's only when you go outside of that you're not eating a biologically appropriate diet then you have to start getting in figures and and calculators and equations and trying to figure out your macro we've got to calculate this and do that why would you ever need to do that we haven't had counters you know for the majority of human existence you know no animals in the wild use use calculators any sort of formula to figure out what to eat or how much to eat there are natural processes that allow us to know you know when we're eating uh when we need to eat how much we need to eat and when we're when we should stop it and when you're eating when you when you get deranged on that and you get fat and get sick and you're overeating you're eating something wrong you know if you need later to figure out what to eat you're eating the wrong thing you should not have to do that if you've been eating intuitively for 99.99999 of human human existence why can we not figure it out now that yeah that's a very good point yeah yeah well um and and that that's that's something I never do anymore is worry about how much protein how much fats whatever I just ate what I want and uh it seems to work yeah and it does work so what are you eating these days uh what's a normal what's a normal day for you so only once a day only at breakfast time um and I'll have between eight and ten eggs scrambled with cheese and then I'll just top that with like about 600 grams of ground beef or 600 grams of um of uh sliced beef like wagyu beef so it's really fatty nice and and that's all cooked in beef teller very good yeah yeah yeah and um that keeps me satiated all day it's been you know of all the health things that have happened and improvements I've had one of the major things that carnivore is good for outside of health is just making you so much more time efficient and so much more productive you don't think about food anymore and you don't spend as much time in the kitchen you don't have to mess around and go oh hang on I'm really hungry I'm just going to pop into the shop over there there's none of that you don't spend the day in the office thinking about food at all and you know it's it's just honestly I reckon you get back one to two hours in a day at least yeah easily I yeah I I think that um that's been that's been one of the best things apart from how amazing I feel um that that getting back that time is is incredible because it takes me you know six minutes minutes to cook a steak I let it rest for 10 minutes and I eat the thing and take my time enjoy myself and so call it an hour and and that's it and I'm done so I figure that you know you're saving on at least two other meals and so that's you know you're eating this for half an hour you're preparing it you're you know maybe rushing through lunch just stuffing something down during during lunch or something like that but maybe you have time maybe you have time for breakfast all these sorts of things but on top of that you have a lot of time before that where you're thinking about eating because you're hungry and you're like man I'm really hungry I really want breakfast man I really want to watch when it's lunch man I'm really hungry I really want dinner and you're snacking and and um you know looking for little things to to get and little treats and and but you're always thinking about it so I think that that time of constant you know focus on food is is very distracting as well and you lose a lot of time and just mental energy and and Sanity just thinking about when your next meal is even though you just ate you know an hour or two earlier and you're already thinking about oh my God something and so I yeah I figure yeah you're getting back several hours where you're not thinking about preparing or eating food and so it's a huge huge gift back to your day I I just I'm so much more productive and I get so much more done uh you know people ask you know how I you know be in residency and doing podcasts and doing um you know consultations in a private Clinic you know outside of my residency like how how do you even do that well because I'm not spending hours a day cooking and eating and and uh and thinking about food I actually have time to do things and one hour a day I'm cooking and eating and and that's it I'm done hmm yeah um the the argument that some people will put up though is that oh yeah but beef is so expensive and you know but my answer to that is always but so is it 20 bucks a day in snacks that you're gonna spend you know like when you're in 7-Eleven all the time that adds up too you know does yeah I think um Sasha Baker just put up a post on Instagram where he was talking about it was just showing through the different costs of certain sorts of you know normal processed food junky garbage and then just showed the average price of ground beef in America he's just like you can you can live with optimal nutrition for you know a quarter of the price of what you'd spend on all this garbage it's really not good for you anyway so beef is not all that expensive it's uh it's certain cuts are expensive you know you get filet mignon or or scotch or Scotch filet in Australia or you know ribeye those are more expensive cuts and yes you're going to be paying a premium for them especially when when people say well I'm going to do this I have to get the highest quality grass-fed grass finish going to go to Whole Foods and just get like okay well yes that then you're going to be paying an exorbitant amount but but you don't need to do that you know ground beef is it's the same cap you know it's it's okay you know yeah and so there's nothing wrong with that it's just you know from tougher parts of the cow that it's not going to cook up well on a steak and so you know you grind it up and and that's fine that's perfectly fine it is just as nutritious yeah is this good for you costs like four dollars a pound on average in America so it's it's much more affordable than almost anything else you think about I think about the cost of like spinach or lettuce you know you got a big bag of that and it's like oh okay so that's you know five dollars ten dollars for like a big bag and but you look at it so it's like three ounces you know because they're literally leaves like that's what that's what they said and so you have a bag of leaves they weigh nothing and uh and it's like ten dollars and so you know if you look at that per pound or per kilo it's more expensive than steak and what are the new what's the nutritional value of spin it's next to nothing you know maybe there's a bit of iron or something like that but it's all bound up you can't actually get it it's not bioavailable really getting protein so you're not getting a complete protein there's no essential fats there's none of the essential vitamins and minerals that you need that want me to something but you know you're not getting a full compliment and a lot of the nutrients that are in there are completely bound up and not really pile available or or um you know minimally so and so obviously you know when you're comparing pound for pound kilo kilo steak is has it all the way it's cheaper and it's Complete Nutrition can't say the same about about the you know lettuce or spinach and so break it down you actually look at that and you look at well I'm eating a kilo of meat a day and that's what I eat for 24 hours and even if I do more expensive cuts like you know rib eye or something like that I'm still saving money I'm still not spending on now you can do it really cheap and just live on Top Ramen or something like that but you know you're going to be nutrient nutritionally deprived you know and and yeah but you know and you get to be hungry all the time you're gonna be hungry all the time and you're and you're gonna be sick and you're gonna be miserable you're not gonna do very eventually you're going to get nutritionally deficient and or whereas you can eat ground beef and eggs relatively cheap they're getting way more expensive in America it was like I think like a thousand chicken farms have been like burned down just randomly as you do they just they just torch up you know these chickens that are smoking or something like that so there's something where you know people are trying to really mess with the the food supply certainly and certainly the meat and egg supply in America and I don't care and I don't think that's by accident I don't think that a thousand chicken farms just go up and smoke uh coincidence when that's really never happened before and you know two nearly two dozen or so um meat processing plants have been burned down as well it's just you know a year for random fires I guess clearly arson and uh you know there are certain powers that be or activists or extremists that are that are that are going nuts but um I have no idea who's behind it but I you know I have a hard time believing that these are all just coincidental accidents hmm it's too many too many happening to be a coincidence yeah I think so yeah but even then yeah it's still cheap ground beef is still cheap eggs are still cheap in respect to anything else you want to eat and their Complete Nutrition their perfect nutrition and you know you don't need anything else and so you know that that's what people can do hmm so what yeah [Music] so you said you you um like your wife and your kids um are there with you are they are they eating the same way too or or what are their thoughts on this no they they're just kind of thinking oh well you know Daddy's off doing these weird thing whatever you know um it was hard so for me the two hardest things to get started with this will really kind of getting my wife to understand no I'm not I can't eat that stuff anymore and also getting my boss too but that's another story because she's always bringing in like I have some chocolate I have some chocolate you know um but yeah once you know about a monthly and when my wife understood like I'm not going back um she's she's been fine I mean she's a nurse so she's kind of she's got the she's trained to think the opposite way about food and all that kind of thing you know but um you know she she sees the results and she's quite happy for me you know okay and my daughter she's six she's just like yeah you don't eat that stuff anymore do you so I just you know whenever I have the junk food or whatever it is no I don't have to offer it's Daddy so yeah yeah probably pretty happy with that yeah yeah that's good and I'm sure you know she's it she's at that you know impression it's still an impressionable age that you know seeing daddy do this she's going to be interested in what you're doing and probably want to do with you at some point or at least you know be influenced to eat eat more meat which is good and that won't be and hopefully they come around and you know and just see you know the great results you're getting and how you're feeling and I mean you have a you have a podcast with I mean I don't even know how many you know dozens and dozens and dozens of videos um you know does your wife watch those things or is just that's your that's that's your time in the shed you go do your thing and yeah she is she knows that they're there and you know so I'll disappear to make a video and then you know a couple of hours later come back and whatever but she's yeah she's kind of not not all that interested at the moment she says yeah this is just some hobby he's got going so yeah well yeah I think yeah I think it starts that way and and eventually people start seeing you know because you know the truth will out and you know you see he's getting better results you're you're more and more healthy feeling uh you know more energetic and and able to do more things and I mean she must have noticed the you know the neurological benefits of you walking oh yeah like that it was her that was looking at the videos initially when like the comparison and going hey this looks different you know yeah yeah and so I mean those sorts of things you know will eventually start hitting home they're like okay well this is this is probably to do with the diet maybe this is something I should consider um how not happen with my family they just sort of and just you know when when I came to Australia and when I was in in Seattle just people around me just threw osmosis just started becoming you know being eating more and more meat and becoming carnivores hmm and they started getting really good results and asking me about it and and doing really well with it and others you know hadn't had no interest in it but but uh a lot of people in my in my surroundings just got more and more interested in it just by seeing my results and and then asking me questions about it and then just I think I started like a Grassroots movement in Australia because no one here was was doing doing this when I got here uh everyone was was vegan or going that way and uh and I just sort of just just threw the people I was talking to I ended up having to get into conversations and debates with people two three times a day every single day like it was just oh well important to do that you know because you know if I feel just important thing for people to know about and so I knew I took the time to to do that and um you know and so just like just more and more people just started doing this and then they sort of messaged me and like oh what about this and what about this and you know I help them out and uh yeah just more and more people started doing it I yeah I turned many many vegans and vegetarians uh for what I met here and um and in Seattle as well so wow yeah it's um it's been it's been good for that I think that's that's helped me you know with the podcasting with everything like that because I just had so much experience talking to people about this explaining to it and answering all their questions and being able to just fire back you know rapid fire answers and you know I it's always the same arguments always the same reason why you shouldn't eat and you should eat vegetables and fruit and you know but but these all have answers they all have reasons why those aren't true and so you get very practiced at telling that and so it just got easier and easier and easier and I started getting like a rhythm and uh and sort of a like a Salesman pitch on like how I was going to approach this like okay here we go again I'll just and so you know I think now there's actually big community of carnivores here I met a I met a GP um at one of the conferences in in Gold Coast that I was speaking at and and he was saying it's like oh yeah you know from Perth and I've got 51 carnivore patients and they all watch your videos I'm like oh that's pretty crazy wow yeah and so that's just the one practice and he's got 51 specifically carnivore patients and so yeah it was to see but uh yeah you just you just sort of influence people around you and it just you know becomes more and more yeah interesting to people so hopefully hopefully your family takes note of that yeah well that practiced answering of questions as well that's the point I hope I can get to you know in the not too distant future because you know I want to be able to just counter everything yeah um yeah we'll be able to and uh it's just that's it it just it just comes from from talking to people and you know and then people will ask you and I said well what about this and what about this and you just have answers and sometimes you don't maybe you're just like I you know I think that that's right but you know maybe I should go look that up and helps you reinforce your knowledge in it as well you know that was that was why I did that my very first video and I it's still my favorite video and that was you know because I did a debate on Carnivore versus vegan diets um with the Amer Australian College of nutritional environmental medicine acronym and so I had to I had to really hone down my arguments and just be okay because we only have seven minutes so I had to like really bullet point out you know what I was going to say or why we should be eating meat why we should not be eating plants and and then I sort of did a fuller video where I'd you know flesh things out of it and and I think that that that video covers most of the arguments that you'll see you know it covers covers the basis on on why we should be doing this and counters all the arguments why we shouldn't be doing this or why we should be doing veganism or vegetarianism or at least including plants instead and um yeah and it just it just comes from you know just just you know person after person debate after debate and and then just people honestly asking questions and and being able to to talk through the answers and that that really helps you you know structure the responses in your mind and and actually think about these things it's there's nothing better than than discourse to really hone your thoughts and really develop them because you know if you're you're if you're not if they're not being challenged and tested and prodded at you know they may fall apart you know very easily you need that challenge you need people to go mobile what about this more about this and have really good arguments against you so that because a maybe you're wrong you know and that's good to know you need to you need to be good enough to think that hey I don't I don't know everything and uh you know I'm not Garth Davies I don't think I know everything and [Laughter] it's um you know you have to be you know have enough humility to to understand that you know there's the vast majority of human knowledge you have no idea of and all the entire embodiment of human uh of human knowledge is not one fraction of one percent of the entire available information that's that's around you know if it's not and so having that understanding that you know you could learn something it's very important and then having people test and poke and prod at your arguments to make you you know reinforce them and say hey okay you know maybe I got that one a little bit wrong I need to structure this better or what's a better way of explaining this that will do a better job and you just get just get better and better at it so yeah so just just just uh enjoy the uh enjoy the interaction because that's where you get that polishing up of your arguments yeah and yeah I I really am enjoying the discourse so far so yeah yeah okay do you uh bring my you know uh vegans and vegetarians and things like that on as well if you had discussions with them or I I haven't yet um I hope to I've I've really only just started um doing more of a regular interviewing so um yeah I hope to uh because yeah I I think you should be able to kind of talk to the the other side and and you know potentially agree to disagree and and whatever it happens to be you know yeah I think so too unfortunately it's hard to get people to agree to come on and agree to just have it because I think I think you know and maybe rightly so you know anytime you have people with differing opinions and you get invited onto the speakers on hey let's let's have a talk you're always looking for an ambush you know you're always being like okay uh yeah up or something like that or or whatever or you know you just don't want to be shown up and your reputation is worth more than than that interview would uh would bring to it so um you know it's um you know it's something that I think is very important to do though you know and something we we used to be very normal that you'd have you'd have public debates all the time you'd have it's like oh well this person says this we're like well let's talk about it great meet you on Tuesday we'll be we'll be at the Town Square that used to happen all the time now it's very difficult it's very difficult to get that um to get that going on and um yeah there's there's one uh radio program in America that asked me there's a guy who was talking about the carnivore diet he was trying to get like a bad bar K show to talk to him and and you know Professor K was just like look you don't have any background you don't have any published work you you're calling yourself all these things but it doesn't really back it up here you don't have a big Channel you'll have this like it's not really you know anything I'm interested in like I don't think you really bring me much to the table and um so he made a video about that in a bash video about carnivorism and you know and um and uh I was on this radio program before I think I was like hey you know would you like to come on and sort of debate with this guy that's why I watched it and and you know the arguments that he was making were um you know there's a lot in a number of different ways and that I could point out and be like well actually that has an exclamation that has an explanation that has an explanation and so you know I agreed to to come on and do this you know [Music] um you know I mean it's it's not it's not necessarily going to do anything for me but I think it's important to have these discourse and this guy is actually eager he's like yeah I know I'd love to like okay well then let's do it you know let's have let's have a discussion you know because I think it is important it is important to have people flesh out these ideas and I I you know that was the thing I didn't start my YouTube channel for so long because I had these conversations so many times where I'm basically talking to someone and convincing them of this you know de novo every single day and so it's just yeah I wish I could just get someone to this like just hey why don't you sit down with me why don't we record this and then like put that up and um because I thought that would I thought that would be just perfect and so having that interaction well what about this and what about this one because those are the questions people want to know because they're always the same questions well what about cholesterol well what about Fiber Well it doesn't increase your cancer risk well don't you need vegetables for vitamin as well all these different sorts of things they're always the same questions and they all have the same answers and so if you have that that sort of live discussion and you can answer that I think that that's very very helpful so yeah and you can you can convince someone to come on there it's difficult I have tried with many people it doesn't go well yeah and maybe reach out to gath Davies and see if he wants to come on you can do that I have no interest in speaking to that anymore yeah I've I've said what I had to say to that guy so that's great so what's what's uh what's the idea for the future of your channel where do you plan to go from here I don't really know I don't have much of a plan except I just want to keep pushing the word out there and I want to keep connecting with people that are in um that are either already carnivore or a kind of you know edging towards it and you know um you know I I did a live stream this morning and um it was just so nice this kind of community feeling of people who are just getting starters and people that have been on there on Carnival for a few months and everyone's trying to help each other out I really I really enjoy that so yeah yeah that sounds really nice yeah well I think you should definitely keep it up and just keep putting out the videos out there and um and yeah and your channel is growing very very well which is awesome to see and I haven't been Shadow banned yet like the rest of us hopefully that not yet not yet this time yeah it was always time yeah you can always you can always say something that catches the algorithm be like oh about this guy um yeah I've just noticed more and more of that that uh people have been noticing saying that they're getting unsubscribed from my Channel or they're getting they're not getting notifications or even when they search for me by name my videos don't come up so uh going on but um and then like on Instagram people share my posts and then Instagram takes them down so there's something else going on there as well so uh either way okay we're gonna keep we're gonna keep fighting keep going keep pushing and keep growing either way and that's also the reason for for you and others to make your own platforms because you know hopefully we get enough people flying under the radar and they can't they don't don't Shadow ban all of us you know so you can actually get the message out yeah and you know yeah that's that's the thing the more than barrier um yeah yeah the more people involved and the harder it is to do that so yeah exactly right and you know and eventually this becomes mainstream and people recognize it as like oh actually this is this is the way to go and then maybe they maybe they take the the breaks off of our uh yeah I don't know probably not but you could you can always get lucky yeah I mean if you look at it you know 25 30 years ago low carb would have been treated the same wacky way you know everyone this is crazy this is you know but now if you say I'm low carb I mean people don't blink yeah you know very normal so yeah good all right well damn so much um how do people get a hold of you the the YouTube channel is uh or at zero carb and uh and then that's right yeah and uh and or do you have a podcast itself as well on podcast platforms or is it just on YouTube it's just YouTube at this stage yeah okay great and um and do you have any other social media where people can find you and check out your work um I don't have anything else YouTube's the only thing that I've got at the moment that's good yeah yeah yeah um yeah it gets a bit more complicated with all the all the other things but uh yeah so that's good I envy you just leave it on the YouTube channel and just just keep it there so great um so great well Dave thank you so much I really appreciate your time and uh and hopefully we can we can chat again soon yeah thank you so much Anthony I really appreciate you uh having me on you're very very welcome and thank you everyone for watching I hope you enjoyed that if you did please uh hit the bell and subscribe and like and leave a comment it really does help so and you can let us know what you think about the talk and uh you can follow me on Instagram Anthony Chaffee MD or Twitter at Anthony underscore Chaffey and um or if you want to join the patreon community it's Anthony Chaffey MD as well and uh thank you all very much and see you next time hey guys thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say if you like it then please like And subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcasts and if you're on YouTube then please hit that little bell and subscribe and that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out which should be every week if not more and if you could share this with your friends that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing thanks again guys foreign [Music]