Live Q&A with Dr. Ken Berry, Dr Baker, Dr Kiltz, and Dr Chaffee!

[Music] You know, many people in the world today don't believe it's even possible to eat a diet that consists of only meat and eggs and fish and other animal products. Uh some people believe it's possible, but that it's probably very very dangerous. It'll kill you in just a few months. Uh other people believe, yeah, it's possible. Well, yeah, you could do it for a while, but you don't want to do that for too long. It might cause some medical conditions or medical problems or increase your risk of something bad happening. Well, today I've got three other doctors who espouse, endorse, and practice a carnivore diet. And they've all been doing it long term. Many of them doing it longer than me, which is eight years and change. And I think that if you are a carnivore curious or currently on a carnivore diet or you have a friend who's like, "Well, I would try that carnivore, but I'm afraid my heart will explode." Then this might be the conversation that you want to tag them in or send them a link for. You're all welcome to share this on your favorite social media. I'm going to be joined today by Dr. Sean Baker, by Dr. Robert Kilts, and by Dr. uh Anthony Chaffy and I think the four of us talk about a carnivore diet probably more than any other doctors on YouTube or other social media. And so we've all been doing this for many years. We all are very familiar with it. We've all answered thousands of questions about a carnivore diet and is it healthy or not? And so I'm going to bring these other doctors up. Here is Dr. Sean Baker. Welcome, Dr. Baker. Ken, thanks for having me here. Appreciate it. Yeah, good topic. Always a pleasure, my friend. Here's Dr. Robert Kilts. Dr. Hello, gentlemen. Welcome. Thanks for having me here. Oh, man. It's so great to have you guys. And Dr. Chaffy's father is is sick and in the hospital. And so, he is going to be joining us, but he's it's it may be a few minutes. So, uh, welcome gentlemen. Glad to have you. Now for everybody watching, I want you to know that this is going to be kind of like a roundt discussion. We're going to talk about topics in the carnivore diet that people in the carnivore community are excited about, worried about, talking about. Uh we're going to dispel some carnivore myths. We're going to bring some new carnivore information to light. And later in this video, we got a very special surprise for you. We've got a either a twominut or a threeinut clip from the upcoming documentary called Animal which is about the carnivore diet that all four of us appear in. And we've got Josh the director. He's going to set up that that uh two or three minute clip. It's a good chunk of the film. And so if you've been anxious to watch Animal, the documentary about the carnivore diet, definitely stick with us and hang out with us and listen to this conversation because we're going to be showing a good clip of that later in this video. Dr. Baker, how's it going in your corner of the carnival world? Uh, it is going well. uh you know I as you mentioned I've been doing this for a very long time and I have had the great fortune to witness thousands and thousands of transformations of people gaining their health and uh getting their lives back and uh you know just doing uh what you know all of us as physicians set out to do was to actually heal people and not just chronically medicate them. So, yeah, it's been quite good and I I only see uh this thing continuing to expand and grow as as you know, I mean, you just it's hard to keep good things down and uh Yeah. Yeah. So, very very nice and you know as well as I do that the carnivore diet has come to prominence multiple times over the centuries, right? But I think now we've got this magic tool that none of the other doctors who've dis discovered rediscovered this over and over through the decades and the centuries. We've got social media. And I think you're exactly right. Dr. Robert Kilts, fertility specialist in New York. How's everything going in your part of the carnivore world? Everything is uh uh rosy uh and red like red meat, not roses, by the way. Uh it's going wonderful. I mean we're really seeing such amazing changes to so many people suffering from polycystic ovarian syndrome endometriosis. I've even seen uterine fibroid shrink. But certainly uh seeing so many uh uh couples improve their sperm, eggs, embryos and conceive naturally when just nothing's been happening for so long. and you know the remarkable healing we're seeing and and ultimately our foundation is our children and we've seen such a reduction in in reproduction uh for so long and now hopefully we'll see more and more people sort of say hey man I'm going to jump on this and and and and try it out where I don't need shots pills surgeries nor IVF if I had heard you say that nine or 10 years ago when I was first trying experimenting with keto ketogenic diet trying that losing weight reversing pre-diabetes I would have thought you were psychotic because back then I thought a low carb diet very low carb even carnivore it's a weight loss hack right but I had been so miseducated and undereducated about human physiology and human nutrition that if you had said to me oh if you eat a highfat carnivore diet that will increase a woman's fertility rate that will increase a man's sperm motility and sperm health. I would have thought, what? Everybody knows plants are magic. What are you talking about? I want to I want to talk to to each of you guys. When did it first occur to you? You know what? Carnivore is more than just a a weight loss diet. It's more than just a whatever diet. This is this is affecting human physiology at the bedrock level. Dr. Dr. Baker, when did you what was the thing? What was your epiphany like, whoa, this is more than just weight loss? Yeah, I think it the first time I I noticed that, you know, it's not just about weight loss was when I was still practicing orthopedics full-time and I would put my patients on, you know, low carbon ketogenic diets at the time. And I ended up canceling surgeries because people's knees stopped hurting, you know, even though the bone the X-ray was would have warranted a knee replacement. So, that kind of clued me in that, hey, the diet can can make a big difference. But I mean somewhere you know after going carnivore and then and then uh back in 20 I think 17 I convinced 100 people to do carnivore uh while I was work while I was you know discussing it on Twitter and you know we got the results back and I mean yes they all lost weight but more importantly every imaginable symptom got better all of them the the metrics that we could measure around health improved dramatically so uh you know that was the beginning of that and then again since that time I've seen you know, and some just some really freaky things that get better. You know, all these autoimmune diseases, all these even genetic diseases that you would think like like I'll give the example of Aaylor's Danlo syndrome. It's a genetic connect connective tissue disorder with a problem with type 1 collagen. And these people who chronically dislocate dislocate their joints, they go on a carnivore diet and their joints stop dislocating, which I still to this day cannot quite figure out why that occurs, but it does and I've seen it over and over again. So yeah, it's been uh and this is something what I talked about early on when I saw people talking about ketogenic diets in the context of either weight loss or diabetes. I said, "Look, it's much more than that." And now, as you know, people are talking about mental health, but it's it's so much more. I mean, there's so much more. And I think, you know, most of the disease is probably us living in in a discordant fashion from what we're designed to be living at. And I think the carnivore diet is, as you like to say, a proper human diet that puts us into a proper place where our health should be. Yep. Dr. Kilts, what was the moment? Do you remember when you were like, "Wait a minute." Well, let's see. I've been practicing fertility for 30 plus years. And about 20 years ago, I integrated acupuncture, yoga, meditation, prayer to kind of destress and and hopefully reduce cortisol, epinephrine, help people stay in the game and and reduce inflammation. And some of my patients were getting pregnant on this diet called Paleo. And I said, I had no like how are you getting pregnant on Paleo diet? So I dug into it and and uh I then found keto and then I ran into carnivore and and uh I suffer from arthritis, psoriasis, migraines, kidney stones, bowel bleeding and more myself and they went away. They got better on paleo, better on keto and gone on carnivore. And so, you know, I I figured like it's my job to share with our patients something that it didn't make sense until you dig deep and and realize this isn't new. It's been around a long time. If you read Salisbury stuff from the from the 1800s uh and and and many more people, you'll realize uh that that plants ultimately are poisonous for humans in any significance or frequency or in some cases small amounts is all it takes. and and um the the companies that used to tell us that tobacco wasn't harmful for us somehow managed to buy up the uh plant all the other food companies and and basically hoola, you know, it it we're we're going to we're going to tell you that plants are good and no one's going to argue with that one because we know fat is bad and and we see so many people healing on on paleo keto and and and carnivore is is quite amazing. And interesting enough, the birth control pill and the abortion pill are made from plants and and you know, when you start thinking about this stuff, it it's it's radical. But we've been, you know, we talk about a lot and there are more and more people as you're seeing uh looking at at carnivore as like the top of the line. Uh the last I looked I think we're more like lions than we are like pigs, cows, and sheep. Yep. And I'll tell you guys the the two quick stories that made me go, "Wait a minute, there's something more to this." I had a 48-y old woman and a 51-y old woman, both flirting aggressively with menopause, right? But they both came in and they they had seen my weight loss transformation. I'd went from 297 pounds to probably at that time 250. Uh still overweight, but way better. And they both wanted to try this diet. And then it was it was basically meattheavy keto. And I said, 'Yeah, give it a try. And so at either three or six months followup, both of them came back in. They both lost weight, but they were also both pregnant. One was very, very happy about this because they've been praying for a baby. That's the 48-year-old. And I'm like, weird, but okay. And you know, that happens. Then the 51 year old came in and she was not happy at all about being pregnant. Uh, and I was on her chit list for quite a few months and because my diet had made her get pregnant. And that's when I was like, "This is reaching deep in physiology. That's weird." And then I had a guy and I I used to be an X-ray tech before med school. And so I had x-rays in my office. I would shoot x-rays every day. And I had x-rayed this guy. He weighed about 450 pounds. And I put him on just beef, butter, bacon, and eggs. I said, "Zero carb. Let's see how much." because he was scheduled for knee replacement. And I and he's a preacher. We're still friends on Facebook to this day. And he came back in and he was walking with two canes when I saw him, one in each hand. He came back in and he was so heavy, guys. He had to go to the co-op and weigh on the feed scale. He could not weigh in any doctor's office. That's how heavy he was. So, we were we're guessing 450 because that's as high as my scale went up. He comes back in in either three months or six months. He had lost 80 90 pounds. Wow. And he was walking with one cane and he said, 'You know, my knee still bothers me a little, but this other one doesn't hurt at all. He was scheduled for bilateral. He said, I called the surgeon and canceled that. Is you think that's wise? Is that smart? And I'm like, well, yeah. If it's not hurting you, then don't. And so the next time I saw him, six months later, he's walking with no canes. And this is still documented on on the Barry Clinic Facebook page. If you scroll back enough years, you can see him. I videoed him walking up the hall with no canes. And it had been years since he had walked with a cane. And I know for a fact that his knees were bone on bone because I had x-rayed them in my office. It was not just a self-reporting bone on bone. It was at that those three moments I was like, there's way more to this than weight loss. Now, everybody watching, I'd love it if you'd tell me in the comments what what carnivore has done for you. And if you haven't already done so, hit the thumbs up or the or the heart and please consider sharing this. We're going to have Dr. Anthony Chaffy joining us here in just a few minutes. He's tending to his very ill father, but he's gonna try to jump on here when he can. Uh let's talk about let's get controversial. You guys up for it? There's all No, we don't like controversy. We like it. Face when I said that. Okay, there's this rumor, theory, hypothesis going around in the carnivore community that if you're too strictly carnivore for too long, that it can cause something that's been labeled insulin suppression, and that it can that it can in a negative way, a pathological way suppress your body's abil ability to secrete insulin from the beta cells in your pancreas. Have you What do you think about this? What have you heard? What are you seeing? And because I know both of you guys work with thousands of people just like I do. Have you seen this? Do you think this is real? If not, what do you think's going on instead? We'll start with Dr. Baker. Uh, well, I mean, certainly we see people's insulin come down on on carnivore. And we see it on a ketogenic diet as well. A lot of people have insulins 20, 30, and then on carnivore it'll be consistently below five, maybe 2, three or something like that. Um, I don't know that that is suppression. Um, I think that when people say, you know, I've heard people say that you must have carbohydrates to stimulate insulin secretion from the pancreas. Well, that's just clearly not true. We know that protein will also stimulate insulin. Um, I think if we look at, you know, if you can say like, you know, we don't like it because insulin levels are relatively low compared to the general population. when we think about what would be the consequence of insulin suppression uh you would see a type 1 diabetes basically I mean you would see um uh you know the person would become emaciated and and I just don't really see that to any significant degree so any clinical um you know sort of supposition from insulin suppression would would would tend to have someone towards type 1 diabetes um it's not to say that you know no one could develop diabetes these, you know, autoimmune diabetes or something because those things we we know those things occur in older particularly in older populations. Yes. Uh so I I you know like I said I don't know and I think Ben Bickman has mentioned this as well in a very nice way. It says that a lot of people, you know, their insulin was low and and the assumption is their their insulin is not suppressed, but they're very highly insulin resistant due to adaptive uh, you know, glucose sparing, whatever you want to what you have you. But if you give those patients insulin, their glucose will drop like a rock. I mean, they're still very sensitive to that hormone. It's just that not a lot of it it needs to be secreted and is secreted. And so, so you would, you know, what I would say is what are the clinical uh outcomes? I saw, I think it was Rob Cyus talking about he had a patient that was, you know, didn't have high insulin and he made the supposition was insulin suppression. But the guy was doing fine. He was lean, he was muscular, he wasn't wasting away. It was just monkeying with the numbers basically. And I think sometimes we get lost. Uh, you know, you know, we lose the forest for the for the trees because we're like we're playing with numbers. We don't like these numbers. We're uncomfortable with certain numbers. But then when we actually talk to the patient, say what's actually going on? How are you doing? How are you feeling? You know, it doesn't match up our preconceived notions. And I think realistically, we have to realize that carnivore physiology is probably different than carbased physiology. And if you even if you look at carnivorous animals and you start looking at their blood glucose and their insulin parameters, it looks like a carnivorous human, which not surprisingly that makes sense. So I'm I'm not I'm not that concerned about that quite honestly. Now we have Dr. Anthony Chaffy, who's just been able to join us. His father's ill, so we obviously will forgive his tardiness. And uh Anthony, welcome. Your father's in our prayers. I hope everything's going okay. Would you like to to give us your opinion about is insulin suppression a real thing if you stay too strictly carnivore for too long? Hey guys, just want to take a second to thank our sponsor, Carnivore Bar. I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat. For those times that you're out hiking, road tripping, or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat, fat, and salt if you want it, the Carnivore Bar is a great option. So, I like this product not because it's just pure meat, but also because I want the carnivore market to thrive as well. And the more we support meatonly products, the more meatonly products there will be available in the mainstream. So, if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind, check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off, which also applies to subscriptions, giving you 25% off total. All right. Thanks, guys. Well, thank thank you very much for that, first of all. Um, not in my experience. I mean it it doesn't it doesn't line up with our evolutionary history with the the what we observe in native populations like the Inuit who are largely if not exclusively carnivorous by choice and also by circumstance. You're up in the North Pole. There really isn't anything else to eat. You know, people can say, "Well, they're eating fresh meat and there's glycogen. There's not actually all that much glycogen and then does it break down and it gets into lactate." you could hold down all that down that rabbit hole, but really what we're saying is we're eating we're eating the same thing, right? And so we're eating meat and it has a certain amount of glycogen. It has a certain amount of other nutrients and and it has the physiological effects that it has. Um it doesn't, you know, you have the Native Americans who are eating pemkin for most of the year that's dried. So you're not, you know, you're definitely going to get the breakdown of that glycogen into lactate. And so you can't really have that argument either. But either way, you get everything that you need from meat. And we don't see the sort of this type one expression in the Inuit. They have the very very healthy outcomes. And so you can't live generation after generation after generation if that were the case. And so, you know, maybe there's there's, you know, even in in Dr. Civy's um experience, he he's talking about isolated examples of people that have strange numbers on their test. And like Dr. Baker said they were they were otherwise very healthy. And there's a there's a saying in medicine which is you treat patients, you don't treat lab tests. And so having an isolated or you know a few isolated examples of someone who has numbers on their blood test that we don't really fully understand but otherwise healthy, that's not necessarily reason to throw the baby out with the bath water. And in my experience, I I haven't had even an isolated example of that in my clinical practice when people go on carnivore ketogenic diets. And we've had we've had people on ketogenic diets a lot longer um than than just this recent iteration of a carnivorous ketogenic diet, a plant-free ketogenic diet. So, this isn't something that, you know, really really showed up. And so, um I I agree with with Dr. Baker that if this if this was true insulin suppression, we should see elevated blood sugars. We should see people having a sort of a type one expression or a lot of or some sort of um sign of insufficiency that if if you have insulin insufficiency or suppression causing insufficiency, there should be consequences thereof, namely high blood sugar, keto acidosis, those sorts of things. And that's that's I I haven't seen that yet personally myself anyway. Yeah, I agree with both of you guys. Dr. Kiltz, have many how many cases of insulin suppression have you diagnosed and have you treated because of a carnivore diet? If I saw someone with a low insulin level, I would suspect type one diabetes and I haven't seen anyone on a carnivore diet. Although, um, I've measured my insulin levels and glucose on a fast and it's been less than two on a three to five day fast. My glucose levels are between 45 and 55 asymptomatic and doing normal function. My theory about insulin is it's a digestive hormone. It's rises when you consume amino acids and sugars and it goes to the liver and in the liver it converts amino acids sugars to fat. That's its job. If you're eating a high fat only then and and all though you likely should see a little bit of insulin because there is some sugar and proteins in fat but um I haven't seen that uh and I suspect that you know carnivore is the healthiest thing you could do and it should be a fatty meat carnivore and I enjoy fasting because uh you really get lower glucose, lower insulin levels and you feel fantastic. So yeah, I totally agree. I totally agree. I think I think we all agree on that. Now, you brought up u that when you eat anything, your insulin elevates. And so, there's another thing that I've heard in the carnivore community that there's a subset of a subset that's now recommending a lower fat carnivore diet because if you eat too much fat, that can cause an insulin spike, which can slow down weight loss or or fat metabolism, fat loss. I have I'll just go first and say I have first of all that's not how human physiology works. You have a very small elevation in insulin when you eat fat. Uh you have a much higher elevation when you eat protein and then you have the insulin spike when you eat carbohydrates. Have any of you guys and we'll go in alphabetical order. Baker Chafy kills. Have you guys do you does this make any physiological sense to you? Do you recommend a lower fat carnivore diet to anybody any time? And there may be exceptions to this, but we'll go with Dr. Baker first. Yeah. I mean, just to your point on insulin and fats, you know, fat stimulating insulin secretion. There was a a recent cataric study looking at uh uh you know, they they found recently deceased people and they kept the beta cells alive and they they secrete they they tested them against fat, protein, and carbs. They did find that in about 9% of the cadaavvers fat actually was quite potent at stimulating insulin. So I think there is a small set of population out there of people where they do get an insulin response due to fat. So it's not completely zero. Having said that um a carnivore diet is always going to be a highfat diet. Now there are degrees of fatness you might say. So some people will really thrive on very high ketogenic ratios. Other people s you know sort of thrive with maybe 60% of their calories coming from fat. That's similar to what I often do. So ribeye steak for instance reasonably marble is going to get you about 665% of your calories coming from fat. That is still a very highfat diet but it is a lower fat carnivore diet. So that may be some the misconception there. Uh going to like protein sparing modified fast levels is not consistent with you know a carnivore diet. Um certainly you can use it and people can do use that to lose weight and people do from time to time. It's not sustainable. uh you're going to be dealing with hunger a lot and uh it's not something that I you know like like we said there are all kinds of weight loss hacks for quick weight loss sugar diet carnivore diet fat fasting dry fasting wet fasting all kinds of things but I mean you know I think at the end of the day you have to figure out something that's going to work for you over the long term and if you're doing a carb reduced or you know essentially carb-free diet um then you need adequate fat and that's going to be like I said 1 one 2 one 1.5 5 to1 something somewhere in that range is probably going to be appropriate for for almost all people. Yeah. Dr. Chaffy, what do you think about this this idea? Yeah. So, I I I think that it it can certainly be dangerous. Honestly, I think that people can run into serious problems. You can you you know, there's many ways to skin a cat. You know, everybody knows you starve yourself and doing these sorts of things. You can lose weight. That's not really the point. The point is to gain health. And as you improve your health and increase your health, you will also normalize your body habitus and your your body composition and you and you'll lose fat if you have excess fat. But your weight and your and your body composition follows your health. And so that's why I always I always try to to make that the most important thing that I that I um prioritize with my patients is that we're working on your health first, then body composition very distant second. And if you're working out and you're putting on lean body mass and you're losing fat, the scale may not change all that much. So people think that like, wow, I'm I'm not losing weight even though I feel good. And so you need to be aware of that. And then nowhere on that list, I tell my patients, nowhere on that list is your weight. Because your weight does not say anything about your uh health or your body composition. And so it's it's about health first. And when you're when you're doing when you're cutting out all the fat and you're starving yourself, sure, you're going to lose weight, but it's not sustainable. As Dr. Baker said, "What are you going to do long term?" It's better to set yourself up for future success and set your habits up now uh for what you're going to be doing in the future. You should be doing the same thing now that gives you good health now that you will be doing 5, 10 years, 15, 20 years down the road, something that's going to maintain those positive effects that you've had. Now, maybe that doesn't get you there as fast as you want them to, but slow and steady wins the race. This goes back to ancient Greece, right? you know, just look, stay on the path, do the right thing, even though it seems like it's taking longer, you'll actually get to where you want to go uh faster, better, more efficiently. It's also very important for people to realize that fat is not just a calorie source. It's not just something that's going to, you know, add to your your your total calories for the day and maybe those calories need to be stored. They're essential nutrients. There's a set of essential nutrients. They're essential fatty acids you have to have or you can get sick and die. They're essential fats, soluble nutrients that you have to have or you can get sick and die. And by eliminating those, you can actually hurt yourself. And I've had many people reach out to me that they have tried this um this sort of short-term sort of diet. Um you know, they paid thousands of dollars to go into these courses and and basically what they're told is do a carnivore diet, but mostly eat protein, low fat, and under 1,000 calories a day, and get outside and exercise. But I I have no doubt that that's going to make people lose weight, but it's also going to make them less healthy. And people are telling me that they're having serious health issues as a result of that. They're losing their hair. They're um having other sort of serious issues as well. And um and that they have to break out of that. Okay. So, you can't do that forever. What do what do you do? What do you go back to? You haven't taught them, you know, how to how to live and how to how to eat properly. Um and so now they say, "Okay, I can't maintain this. I can't continue this." And what do they do? They go back to sort of whatever they were doing before and they sort of do that yo-yo diet. So, I think that's that's an issue. Definitely agree with the idea that that fat is not your main uh concern for insulin um elevation. It has some some u properties where it will will slightly raise insulin in some cases, but protein is going to do it a lot more. Carbs are going to do it a lot more than that. And so, if we're worried about insulin specifically, fat is actually where you want to lean into. And um from from very quickly from a weight perspective, this is something that was that was pointed out by Dr. Michael Eids. And he just pointed out that, you know, we're looking at this equation the wrong way. We're saying, well, there's there's nine cal there's um nine calories per gram of fat and four for protein and and carbs and that sort of not exactly that. But um what he pointed out was we're looking at the wrong way around because calories don't weigh anything. Grams weigh something. And so it's actually one gram per nine calories. So you get more bang for your buck where it's actually 2.2 grams per nine calories for protein and carbs. So if you want to pull in less weight, if you eat a pound of steak, your system will weigh one more pound, right? And so if you're eating lean and you have to eat three pounds to get the same calories, then you have to take in three pounds, whereas otherwise you take in one pound. And so you're you're actually bringing in less grams of nutrition into your body. So that's something to think about as well. But from an insulin standpoint, um you should not have that is not what you need to worry about as far as insulin is concerned. Yep. I totally agree. And Dr. Chaffy mentioned skinning the cat in his answer. And if you do skim the cat and decide to eat it, I would recommend frying it in butter and wrapping it in bacon because cat is very, very lean. Now Dr. Kilts, I've got a question for you. This is probably the most controversial that we're going to talk about today and then we're going to let you guys go around the table. But first, everybody watching this, we got 4,700 people watching this. We need double that number. There are people out there suffering from chronic medical diseases that literally can be reversed by this diet. Please share this on your favorite social media. Please send it in an email or a text message or WhatsApp. We need to get this message out so that the carnivore diet doesn't die like it did in 1797. It became very popular in a in a in a city and then it just died out because there was not enough word of mouth. Then it became popular again with the undertaker. Then it became popular again. Let's not let that happen this time. Now, one of the things that can make a a very therapeutic diet like carnivore get polluted and diluted and die out is when people start trying to carve out their own little niche. Oh, well, you've got to do this or that or it's very complicated, but take my course and I'll teach you how. There's this thing and and we got actually got a a comment here. Todd Adams says, "Let's address the elephant in the room, gentlemen. What's up with the new sugar diet craze?" And I actually made a video on this recently and and and several people tried to crucify me online, but I'm still with us, so obviously they didn't have their intended effect. Uh Dr. Kilts, what's up with this sugar diet? Do you recommend it? What's up? Well, there's only one diet to recommend and that's fatty meat carnivore and and any of these fad fad diets. I mean these are really the fat diets. The species specific diet, proper human diet is simply carnivore. And when we say carnivore, it's fatty meat that is really such a critical thing. And ultimately fat contains every mineral vitamin building block for your body and it's anti-inflammatory. We know about about proteinparing low-fat diets which u I'm not a fan of personally. You might be able to do it in a short term to low-fat diet, but uh protein poisoning is real. And my sense is is that most people eating a fruit, fiber, vegetable, seeds, nuts, chicken, fish, and turkey, which are all lowfat diets. And most people overcook their meat, the fat's gone. And if you look at ponderers, cats, that essentially cooked meat may not be good for any of us. And that may be part of the problem on carnivore. But um you know I don't you know sugar diet I just stay away from all that stuff personally. We know species specific proper human diet. It's fatty meat and insulin is not the cause of disease. It's a lowfat plant-based diet. That's really simply it. Insulin's job is to make fat in the liver. If it doesn't do that you're dead. And and insulin goes up when your sugar amino acids go up. It's supposed to do that. So, I stick to the information I learned from Dr. Baker, Dr. uh Barry, Dr. Chaffy, and so many others in this community that really are just speaking the truth, which we're lions, not sheep. Now, everybody uh that's watching this, later in this video, we are going to have a special surprise for you. We got we have the director of the new documentary called Animal. And we've got a I think a twominute clip directly from the documentary that we're going to show you guys in in a few minutes. So stick with us. And if you know anybody who's carnivore curious, send them a link to this video. Dr. Chad, Dr. Baker, a mutual friend of ours is who made the video about this sugar diet. Uh, I really really want your honest comments about this sugar diet craze. Yeah, I actually have got a nice video coming out where I did quote unquote the sugar diet, but I did it without sugar and I'll explain why. So, um, you guys remember what quashiiorore is. So, that is a protein malnour protein malnutrition state. We see it when these starving kids in Africa with the, you know, they look like skeletons with bloated bellies. Those kids get enough calories. They get a pure carbohydrate diet with no protein and they do in and they do indeed lose weight. And so when our body senses that we are low in methionine, we are low in leucine, we are low in branch chains amino acids, we we secrete this substance, this hormone called FGF-21, fiberglass growth factor 21. And when that occurs, we do, you know, mobilize fat and glycogen. And we we because we because our body literally thinks we're starving to death. And why kids when they're in that situation get so skinny is because kids are in this rapid growth phase. Adults, what happens to adults is they they get the typical futarian type of situation over the long term. Right? Now, for a short-term hack, like anything else, yes, you can eat pure energy and drop your protein down to next to nothing and you will lose weight. However, that's not sustainable. Right? And you know, there is such thing as FGF u um resistance where people if they do this chronically then they become resistant to this. And so to that point, I did a little experiment where I ate nothing but fat, no protein for three days and I dropped eight pounds, right? So sugar diet without the sugar, it's basically a protein restriction diet. That is not a good solution long term. Uh we we all know the dangers of not eating enough protein. It doesn't have to be super high protein, but when you get your protein low enough, um you will tend to lose weight. Uh, but like I said, and you know, honestly, if you stick a sugar diet on somebody who's a type 1 diabetic, a type two diabetic who's poorly controlled, a type two diabetic that's on insulin resistant, you're probably asking for DKA. Uh, these people are going to see their blood glucose go to 300, 400, 500. They're going to end up in the ER uh, in DKA potentially. So, I mean, this is not something you can just willy-nilly play around with. You know, when Kempner was doing his rice diet back in the 1940s and 50s in Germany, all of his patients were impatients. They were inatient under strict examin, you know, strict medical supervision, possibly for that very, very, very well-known reason, although they didn't quite have the understanding what was going on, but they knew they could potentially harm some people. Um, you know, I think that some people will lose weight doing a sugar diet. Um, as you guys know, sugar for a lot of people is an absolute disaster. joint pain, inflammation, addiction, brain fog, you know, hypoglycemia, hyperglycemia. So, there are some, you know, there are some potential issues. Now, if you're a super fit guy and you want to lose 10 pounds, i.e. my friend Mark Bell wants to get ripped down. I mean, yeah, he can do it. He's going to long term. And Mike Mark always likes to talk about strength is never a weakness. And I think he's cognizant enough to know that, you know, you do this long enough and that strength is not going to be there anymore. Um, so you've gota you've gota um, you know, I mean, like I said, I just don't think you can do a long-term sugar diet, particularly if you continually restrict protein. It's going to be a disaster. Not to mention fat. Remember, carbs are in essential. Fat, as Dr. Kiltz astutely pointed out, fat fat fat soluble vitamins and so many other nutrients that are essential to human life. Sugar is not essential. Correct. Hey everyone, really happy to announce a new sponsor for the show and for everybody down in Australia. Stockman Steaks, who are delivering highquality grass-fed and finished pasture-raised beef and other meats, flash frozen and vacuum sealed to your door. Something that I've been enjoying a lot of myself recently as well. They also have a great range of specialty items such as highfat keto mints and carnivore beef and organs mints with liver, kidneys, and beef heart as well. So, use code chaffy today for a free order of beef mints or another specialty gift along with your order at stockmanstakess.com.au. and I'll see you over there. Thanks, guys. Dr. Chapy, are you a big fan of the new sugar diet craze? No, no, no, no. Definitely not. And, you know, like I was saying, you know, it's it's not just about weight loss. Um, there are a lot of ways to to lose weight, but you you want to do it in a way that's healthy and sustainable and eating, you know, proper human diet is is that way is well, it's I think it's the best way. There's other ways that are at least better than the sugar diet. Um, you know, when you're when you're Yes. Okay. you can you can lose uh weight. We are seeing that. Dr. Baker illustrated uh some of the reasons why that could be um and but that you can do it just as easily by restricting your protein and just eating fat or just not eating. I mean these are these are things that people have done for a long time. Um headtohead with a low low carb highfat diet or a lowfat high carb diet headtohead with you know isocoric uh groups the low carb highfat diet worked better for weight loss. And so we've seen this in experimental data sets in humans. But again, it's not just about weight loss because weight loss isn't the end all be all. When you're eating this amount of sugar, you're going to massively increase your blood sugar. You're going to increase your insulin. You're going to increase glycation. You're going to increase fation. You're going to um these people aren't talking about having, you know, sort of whole whole food sort of carbohydrates. They're talking literally talking about eating candy. Hey, you get to eat candy. I mean, so we're literally sort of trying to address this to seven-year-olds and and get them hooked on on this sort of way of eating. It's it's not healthy. I mean, the idea that that we should be promoting eating candy and drinking soda like this is a good thing, I think, is is very dangerous and is going to cause a lot of harm uh in people's health. This is going to make your blood sugar spike. This is all the damages, all the ravages of type 2 diabetes come from elevated blood sugar, causing glycation, damage to your blood vessels, damage to your organs, uh needing amputations, having endorgan um failure, kidney failure, going blind, diabetic retinopathy, Alzheimer's, type three diabetes, hormonal disruptions from the insulin, insulin affecting hundreds of different physiological processes in your body and your brain. and now you're spiking this up and you're getting a disruption an imbalance in that um in those uh in those hormones and physiological processes. So it's it's you know a short-term method that people can lose weight but I think there are better ways of doing that much healthier ways of doing that and ways that you don't h it doesn't have to be short term. doesn't have to be just I'm just going to do this for a few weeks until my body starts having very serious issues and then you have to deal with those issues. You know, doing something in a healthy way is is going to be allow you to do that for the rest of your life. And that's really what we need to to think about and having healthy weight loss with the end result and the end goal being health and let letting your your weight and everything else balance out. You know, my concern as well is that this is this has sort of jumped up so rapidly. I mean, think about how long it's taken for ketogenic, for paleo, for carnivore um to really get a foothold and get out there. It's been a really grassroots movement that's taken years and decades to get going. And people like, you know, Dr. Atkins getting lambasted and things like that. Um, you know, making up stories that he died of a heart attack when he actually died by slipping on ice and hitting his head. Um, you know, textbooks from Dr. Osler in the late early 1900s, late 1800s, specifically saying the treatment for diabetes, type one and type two, they didn't differentiate back then, was carbohydrate restriction. You know, this is this has been a medical intervention for literally centuries now. And yet, we're trying to um but but it takes a massive grassroots effort to to get this back in in the vernacular. Whereas the the sugar diet is just just came like that, you know. And so I just wonder, you know, is this a response from the sugar industry, from the processed food industry because their their cereal sales are going down, their their soda sales are going down. All these things are going down. They're okay, we need to make a response. And are they the ones pushing this out? Not to say that that Mike is getting paid or anything like that, but I would I would be very very suspicious that the the origins of the the sugar diet was being was being founded and pushed by these industries. It would it would uh wouldn't surprise me anyway. And now we're going to touch the third rail of carnivore. Uh oh. I need I need all y'all's opinions. And if anybody cares what I think about the sugar diet craze, I've actually already made a video about it. It's on my YouTube channel. Here's the third rail. Gentlemen, are you ready for it? I need your honest answer. Honey, is it carnivore or not? Dr. Baker, go. No, it's not. Dr. No, it's not sugar and it's it's bee vomit. So, it's not even a part of an animal, right? You know, it's concentrated. Honey carnivore. We're gonna send Dr. Barry out to collect the honey for the uh carnivore meal and he may not come back alive. So, no way. Yeah. And people say, "Well, well, wait. Honey comes from an animal." And that's true. And so does rat but that doesn't mean it's part of your diet, right? All right. Are we are we ready, you think, to to watch this clip from the new documentary Animal? Are you guys ready to see this? Absolutely. Okay. All right. Let me bring Josh. There's Josh Felman. He is the director of the animal documentary. While I'm trying to get my technology in order here, Josh, tell us about this clip we're going to see. Set this up for us while I try to get this ready. Okay. Sure thing. Well, first of all, it's so great to see you guys. Oh my goodness. This is the dream team right here. And uh uh again I want to express how incredibly humbled we are that all of you could make the time uh to appear in this incredible film. Um so so so again what is what is Animal all about? So Animal unmasks a centurylong conspiracy of political, economic and religious forces that we believe and that you all talk about have twisted our natural bond with meat, enslaving us to ill health and big farmer dependency. We got some bold interviews um with you guys obviously. Uh we've got historical revelations, groundbreaking science. It shatters current nutritional myths and dares us to reclaim the ancestral diet that fueled our evolution. And today being a very special day, uh this is the day that we drop the full trailer. So, um Dr. Barry, you and I um spoke just over a week ago. We had the teaser trailer drop. We dropped that. That was 60 seconds. And this is now the full Uh Josh, what I've got queued up is the clip. Okay. Not the not the I don't have the trailer. I have the clip. Okay. All right. We've got trailer on our socials. Okay. Yeah. Because the trailer is already out there. People can watch the full trailer if you just search for animal documentary. But what I've got queued up is the I guess two-minute clip from the actual documentary itself. So, uh do you want to set this up or do you want me to just play it? I think we should just play it and talk about it afterwards. All right. Love it. Let me share this. Okay. Can you guys see that? You see the black screen? I'm gonna hit play. Yeah. Okay. Let me look at other historical populations. The work of Dr. J. Salsbury showed when he was living with the Native Americans in the Great Plains, they were predominantly just eating bison and they were extremely healthy. and Salsbury found that they were actually living well over 100 as healthy, active adults, not just sitting in a nursing home turning to dust over 40 years, but actually out there with packs on their back following the buffalo herds day in and day out. So, he was reversing autoimmune issues uh like rheumatoid arthritis, Crohn's, gout, helping people with tuberculosis, and other sorts of serious illnesses affecting people in the 1800s by putting them on a pure red meat and water diet. And this was studied for decades after him. And yet now we've had that overshadowed by the propaganda that meat and animal fats are harmful to our health. What if the key to restoring your health lies not in cutting back, but in embracing a more primal approach? What if meat, simple, nutrient-dense, and unprocessed, could be your ultimate reset button? the key to restoring your health. Could it be that by returning to a diet our ancestors thrived on, we're unlocking the health we've been searching for all along? And it sounds a little far-fetched because we all die in our 70s and 80s and we think 90 is amazing. But we know as geneticists that we are genetically designed based on the length of our tieumirs on our chromosomes that we are designed to live about 120 years on average. And so why are we dying in our 70s and 80s or 60s? That's literally middle age. Genetically, we're designed to live 120 years. And if you eat what you're designed to eat, you should live as long as you're designed to live. And that is decades longer than we're living now. And that is proof positive that the things that we're eating are poisoning us because slow poison is still poison. And if something kills you 40 years early, you're still poison. Love it. Love it. Love it. All right, let me get back around. Here we go. Beautiful. Beautiful. I love it. Um, so Josh, what do you want to say about this clip we've just seen? And do you have any updates about when this is going to be out? I certainly do. Uh, well, first of all, that's just um one of the one of the many great clips that um you know, we wanted to kind of kind of share with you guys. Um, and as as we mentioned a moment ago, the uh the full trailer is now is now out which you can catch on our website and on all your socials as well. So um then the information regarding the actual release of the movie. So it will be in select theaters and on digital on June 20. So 20th of June is when you can see it. It'll be available digitally anywhere and everywhere you rent movies. So, Amazon, Apple, Fandango, At Home, Microsoft, etc. And then theaters. So, we've got it playing in theaters in New York, um, in LA, in Vegas, in Austin, uh, Houston, and possibly Dallas. Um, there will be an opportunity to host the film in your city if if it's not if if it's not listed in the cities that I just mentioned. So, you can go to our website at animal.mmovowatch and click host a screening to get started hosting in your community right now. Nice. Nice. I love it. Uh Josh, thank you so much for that. And uh we're all looking forward to the premiere of this movie. I'd love to host a premiere in Nashville. Get with get with Alyssa and we'll see if we can't figure out a way to do that. And I know all the docs would love to host it in their town if if possible. Uh Josh Felman, director of Animal, the new documentary coming out June 20. Thank you so much, Josh. Thank you guys. Dream Team, thank you. Thank you very much. All right. Now, uh Axel has a question and I want to rephrase Axel's question into a bigger question. Uh actually two questions. Axel says, "Do you know of any card carnivore cardiologist near St. Louis?" And so my then I want to change that a little so we can answer a lot of people's questions. How can people find a carnivore doctor? Number one. Number two, do people need a carnivore woke or aware or friendly doctor? And then number or number three, should they just uh not tell their doctor what kind of diet they're eating? I'll start with you, Dr. Baker. Uh, well, certainly a lot of people have done a carnivore diet without doctor supervision, and I think for a lot of people, it's fine. There are some people where um therapeutic carbohydrate restriction or carnivore diet can be something that requires supervision. You know, some people on uh pretty intensive uh blood glucose lowering medications, some people on lots of hypertensive, some psychiatric meds. when you decrease the need for those meds and you're still taking those meds, you can get some very scary side effects. Hypoglycemia, hypotension, uh things things of that nature. So, I think there is a se segment of the population that certainly does need some level of supervision. Um you know, there are a number, you know, like all of us do it. I mean, some of us variably practice online. Uh our company, Rivera, we have doctor's license in all 50 states. So, if you need somebody in that regard, we're obviously more than happy to help with that. Um I think that uh you know when it comes to you know and probably all of us agree we came to this conclusion and we're practicing medicine the way we do today using nutrition as a front line despite our training. You know it's kind of like despite being a doctor where they brainwashed you so far the other direction that you're able to see through that. And correct me if I'm wrong but every one of us experience ourselves first before we stuck our toe and start recommending for other patients. And that's I think everyone that I know of that has come to carnivore and practices as a physician has literally done it themselves because they they they woke up to it by by experiencing it themselves. Absolutely. Dr. Kilts, how do you think people need a carnivore friendly doctor? Uh if so, where can they find one? Dr. Philia online is a great spot to go and listen, learn, read his book. Um and I think that social media is really the new medicine. uh we're sharing the knowledge we've learned, but we're also sharing the knowledge we've learned right here from people that are in this community and that's the best way to go. And so, you know, chat with others in all of these support groups uh and you'll learn from others that have gone through it and found out what did they do, what type of issues they've had. And it is kind of interesting uh certainly what what Dr. Baker said, you know, there's some caution depending how many drugs you're on and how severe your your symptoms and disease is, but more and more people are just saying, you know what, I'm going carnivore and I'm feeling better than ever. Uh I I I had a CAC score which was 700 a couple of years ago. Uh I was gifted the test. I would have never done it myself. And and uh I went to my cardiologist, which I didn't have one prior to that. And uh I did I did the treadmill. I did the CT angiogram. He says, "You're fine." And and now he refers patients to me uh to discuss carnivore diet, noting I'm a fertility doctor and and trans trans helping people transition uh right to a carnivore diet. So, um I think you need uh this platform uh and you'll learn about all the potential uh advice that will help you heal. Dr. Chaffy, do people need a carnivore friendly doctor? Yes or no? and and where can they find one? Should your answer be yes? Yeah, I well I think in certain circumstances like Dr. Baker said, it would be a good idea to have some medical support if you're on different medications, blood sugar medications, u blood pressure medications or psychiatric medications or epilepsy medications. These are these are things that that people have been able to reverse these conditions and maybe not need these medications or not as much of the medications anymore, but they're very dangerous to sort of play around with yourself. You would need uh a physician to to help you with that, especially deprescribing off of things like um antiepileptics or psychiatric medications. Very very very uh have to be very careful with that. Um, but in general, no, I don't I don't think you need a doctor to lead you and tell you how to do it or that like we have to be careful because if you're this condition and only certain people can No, everybody can do it and you can just do it on your own. Just be mindful of the fact that if you have these certain medical conditions, certain medications, you may need help adjusting those dosages and uh but otherwise you you don't necessarily need someone to tell you how to do it. Um you can I think the best resources are are these exactly as as Dr. Kil said there are many physicians clinicians PhDs researchers etc and just normal people that have put out an abundance of free information available on the internet because we actually care. We want we we're not trying to profit from this. We're trying to get this information out there because this is this is you know our our birthright as as human beings. We should be healthy. we shouldn't be poisoned by the different things that we're putting into our body. And so just getting that information out there is just it's just a basic um you know right that people have to be healthy. And so we're not we're not trying to profit off of that. There are people that are trying to profit off of this. Don't go there, you know, go to the free ones. There's there's plenty of places. There's Facebook groups been around for 20 years. People have been doing carnivore diets like you know zero carb health, zeroing it on health. People have been doing this forever and they're just this community structure and they just help people out. Um, so if you do need a doctor, and some people just want a doctor, you know, they they want someone that they can see, you know, in the in the nice room with the lab coat and someone in a suit looking at their blood test going, "This is this is this is good. This is a good thing. Your health is improving." They want that reassurance. And so for, you know, for that, I can I can definitely understand that. And and sometimes it's hard to have that animosity with your doctor saying, "You're going to kill yourself. This is a bad idea." It's nice to have someone saying, "No, look, you're doing everything just fine and you're actually improving your health." Um, you know, if people I mean, there's so many people that that get from their their uh doctors and their providers, you're going to kill yourself eating all this red meat, but they don't bat an eye when you're eating processed garbage and candy and lollipops, you know? So, that that's a bit odd as well. And so, um, I don't think you necessarily need to say, "Hey, by the way, I'm doing a carnivore diet," unless you want to. um you know because everybody eats the way that they do and it just is what it is and the doctor sort of deals with oh here's a problem here's a pill don't care about your diet and so you can just say look I'm just I'm just eating a clean whole foods diet I'm trying to be as healthy as I can typically they'll just say great y you know keep doing it I think that's a beautiful point because I'll let everybody watching this in on a little secret does not care about your diet at all they do not care the only reason they ask the question is because there's a little box to check on their electronic medical record. So I think and I'm telling people increasingly a version of what you just said, Dr. Chaffy, if your doctor even ask you about your diet, say, "Oh, doc, I'm on this really good diet. It's sugar-free. I'm I'm not eating any ultrarocessed foods whatsoever. It's all whole food, one ingredient, sugarfree, no ultrarocessed foods." And 99% of doctors are going to go, "Oh yeah, that sounds great." Great. Well, you just described keto, ketoore, carnivore, and the lion diet in one sentence and the doctor just gave you their approval. The vast majority of people when they say, "Do you know of a carnivore doctor in St. Louis?" They really just want to be able to ask a question and have a question answered without the doctor judging them or becoming an emotional or firing them from the practice. And what I think people need to understand is you can get that without having a carnivore friendly doctor in your community. I have a private community with thousands of people who ask me questions and I answer them. Dr. Baker's got Rivero. I know Dr. Kiltz and Dr. Chaffy both have private groups where if you if you just want to ask a doctor questions, it doesn't have to be your doctor. You can go to your doctor for refills and lab work. And if you've stubbed your toe, go see your doctor. But if you have questions about keto, ketoore, carnivore, lion diet, a proper human diet, join my group. Join Rivero, join Dr. Kilt's group. Join Dr. Chaffy's group. We'll answer your questions. We don't have to be your legal doctor. But we are doctors. And among the four of us, we've got many, many decades of of experience of of being doctors for people. and we don't have to be your legal doctor to answer your questions about diet and nutrition. Um, as we wrap up, guys, I want to give each one of you the final word. Dr. Baker, what's what's the the most important thing anybody considering carnivore or currently doing carnivore? They've heard about honey. They've heard about the sugar diet. They've heard about insulin suppression. Let's just simplify this for people. What What's your simple message to people, Dr. Baker? Yeah, I mean meat is just the nutrition and I think that as Dr. Kilz will point out, you got to have you got to eat enough and you got to eat enough fat and you know many things will take care of themselves. Don't overthink it. Don't get distracted. Um enjoy you got to enjoy what you eat. You know, you can't be hungry and you can't not enjoy the food. So if you can't figure out how to make meat taste good, then get some help. No one's died of an anaphylactic reaction to a ribeye steak. Basically, meat is we're not allergic to it. And if someone says you are, I question it. But I think the rare to raw fatty meat, throw some salt and butter on it. It's all you need. It's uh the proper human diet, species specific. And if it's the tripleB or the baby's diet, uh I highly recommend it because then you won't need us for your healthcare. Dr. Chapy, final words of wisdom. Yeah. Well, I I totally agree with that. And I mean meat gives you the the nutrition that you need, but also just remember that other things can cause harm. And so it's it's also about avoiding those other things. You know, you get the meat, you get the nutrition, and that's and that's really important, but other things can actually damage your health. It's not just about, oh, well, you don't have to eat salad. You don't want to eat salad. Salad's bad. It's bad for you. And that that's a very controversial thing to say, but I I stand by it. And there's strong evidence for that. But, you know, just, you know, just be just be mindful of that. Just eat eat meat, fatty meat, until it stops tasting good. And then, you know, don't eat, you know, no plants or mushrooms, no sugar or any sweeteners, and nothing artificial. And if you apply that as a litmus test to the different sorts of things, you know, it it uh it gets pretty easy and pretty straightforward. And as long as you're hungry, meat will taste good and you will enjoy that. And that should tell you something. And when you eat enough of it, um it will stop tasting good. And your body tells you naturally to stop, which again should tell you something about how this is actually is our biologically appropriate diet. Yep. And I would only add to what all these fine gentlemen have said that what they just described to you, a species specific, appropriate, proper human diet. Every other animal on planet Earth knows how to do that instinctually. They don't have to take courses or join groups or go see a doctor. They just know my sheep in the pasture. When they're hungry, they eat grass. when they're full, they stop eating and take a nap or go play. Human beings are designed just like that. Eat the meat when you're hungry, eat the meat till you're full, and then go outside and play. It really is just that simple. Gentlemen, thank you so very much for doing this. Everybody, don't forget June the 20th, the animal documentary will be live and as soon as any of us know what platform it's streaming on, we will let you know. Thank you very much, gentlemen. Have a great day. Thank you. Awesome.