Plant Based India Is One Of The SICKEST Countries On Earth! | Dr. Ankur Verma

the life expectancy in India is right now 67 which is now very high and uh and our meat consumptions actually gone down from about 5.7 kgs per person per year which is really less that I eat that much in a week I think to about 3 kgs per person per year over the past 20 years kg a year yeah yeah yeah and uh and and and the deaths from non-communicable disease has actually increased from 30% to 60% over the past 20 years so it's it's an absolute inverse relation that that that's actually quite obvious if somebody goes through the data we know that Hong Kong has the highest life expectancy right about 87 88 years or something like that and they have the highest meat consumption uh per capita in the world and there are a lot of people who talk about the longivity factor in India we've had a lot of people whove who've actually lived on till about 90 and 100 absolutely and some of them have been really fit some of them were not as fit you know I remember uh I know a lot of grandparents who actually have Dawn to Lady 590 but they were I I don't remember playing around with them I don't remember uh them running around with us too much and it's not just about you know that the vegetarian food is going to help you live longer uh maybe it will in some people but then you also have to look at the quality of life we know a lot of uh people who actually end up in old age homes uh why does that happen I mean welcome to the plant-free MD podcast with Dr Anthony chaffy where we discuss diet and nutrition and how this affects health and chronic disease and show you how you can use this to optimize your health and happiness both mentally and physically hello everyone thank you for joining me for another episode of the plant-free MD podcast I'm your host Dr Anthony chaffy and today I have a very special guest uh Dr Anor vmma who is uh someone who become a friend of mine I was on his podcast recently and now he's kind of enough to come on to mine he's an Emergency Physician over in India and has seen firsthand uh what diet can do to his patients so Andor thank you so much for coming on it's great to see you thank thank you so much Anthony I mean it's been uh an absolutely uh an honor to you know know you for the past few weeks I think yeah I mean uh it was fun having you on the DCM project and you know I've been wanting to come on the plan free MD podcast and yeah here I am it's going to be fun having this conversation absolutely well so for for people Haven come across you or your podcast can you tell us a bit about yourself bit about your podcast and and and what you do yeah so I've been trained in emergency medicine uh and I've been an Emergency Physician for the past 16 17 years uh now yeah and uh I came up with my podcast in 2021 so this is the theem project I mean da basically stands you know I mean Indians are called DA's all over the world by the Indian Community and EM obviously stands for emergency medicine so I came up with this uh in December 2021 and was basically to teach residents regarding emergency medicine topics you know some uh treatment protocols uh new evidences coming out uh you know breaking some myths and dogmas regarding emergency medicine and uh it's been heard in about 45 countries now which is quite surprising for me yeah uh but then uh you know in in 2021 July itself before I start off the podcast uh I tested myself you know and I found out that my triglycerides was 600 and uh so my TG to HDL ratio was basically 16 and you know I was like you know something hit me I was like I've been working out for many years but obviously I used to eat everything possible you know the like like the trainers always tell you that you know since you work out so much eat whatever you want to eat you know I still remember uh Dawning chicken dimsums dimsums which has a lot of carbohydrates around it post workouts uh that was just one of the things I used to do so you know I figured that there's something wrong that I'm doing and it has to be my nutrition and diet obviously I was put on uh statins for the start cuz my LDL was also High I think my blood pressure was also a little high that time so I was put on uh anti-hypertensive M uh but yeah I mean I mean it it hit me quite quickly that I was never trained in nutrition like many other doctors and you know uh we've always been uh advocating uh whatever we've been you know learning and hearing through so many years only with authority after we get our medical degrees uh eat a balanced diet eat a moderate diet have everything in moderation and I've done that to my patients also and uh I I if if you ask me I could never Define a well balanced diet or a moderated or a moderate amount uh you know uh of nut nutrition that people need to eat uh obviously I mean the first thing that I cut down at that time was sugars and junk food which I realized because I used to eat a lot of junk Foods uh so I cut that off uh absolutely and then I started doing my research into nutrition and I think the first book I read was uh uh Professor Robert lustig's metabolical I don't know if you've read that once it's really nice because it was a really nice introduction into metabolic syndromes for me because we've I don't think in in medicine we've been trained regarding metabolic syndromes as a whole because obviously nobody wants to cure metabolic syndromes uh you know you just want to manage them so that was an eye opener for me I was like yeah probably I was metabolically sick I mean even if I used to exercise uh I was inflamed from inside and then uh slowly I slowly I went into ketogenic obviously and carnal like a lot of people have this journey but uh what was important for me was uh the concept of metabolic syndrome so you know I I I started working on that and uh yeah it it took me I think a year to go full carnivore I was always an omnivore I used to love my Meats so it wasn't that difficult because uh I used to eat Meats probably every every day at least one meal a day you know but obviously again it was like the standard diet I would load it up with my carbohydrates so but when I went ketogenic I you know I cut off a lot of a lot of Breads and uh potion controled my rice intake you know start having oats uh for breakfast every day which I figured uh was not right for me after year when I started getting symptoms uh and then I came across I think somebody sent a reel from Paul salarino uh regarding Caro I was like oh this is something new and then through Paul saladino's reals I then got into yours Ken Beres Robert kills sha Baker everybody all of that and then I was like this actually makes sense and I mean it's been more than a year that I turned carnivore and uh and then I started watching all my patients and I realized this is not just me this is basically a pandemic that's happening uh for a very long time so yeah here I am uh talking about whatever I've done to myself uh I mean I lost 21 kgs uh my tg2 H ratio has come come down to 1.6 uh uh i' I fixed a few of my families uh family members some of my friends uh without medications so yeah I mean the word needs to go out and that's what I'm trying to do yeah absolutely well that's great you know it's it's um it's sort of funny well it's can be very shocking you know you're you're a medical professional you're a doctor you're working out you're doing everything right you're eating whatever a balanced diet is and then all of a sudden you get a slap to the face that uh hold on a second I'm I'm actually metabolically unwell and uh that has to be a bit of a bit of a wakeup call yeah absolutely I mean it was a big wakeup call for me and and then I realized that a lot of people around me are also sick and now it's it's so much easier to actually look at somebody and say okay you know it's it's on your face and you're metabolically sick even if you feel that you're not uh even if you're like 25 years old or 30 years old you know I mean age is no bar for metabolic syndromes anymore uh you know the diet has really gone down the drain for everybody uh nutrition is not available for everybody you know and the a lot of myths going around uh for for decades like we all know regarding this so yeah but uh it it's it's it's a good slap that I had and I've really turned my life around you know I I feel great I look at my before pictures and I was like yeah I mean I always thought I was fit but no I was not yeah I just have my son you know he just wants me to show this to you that he's just written this down uh I don't know uh yeah he's just noting down car Foods oh nice to I think yep yeah so there's like fish and prawns and buff and beef and chicken and mutton and pork and yeah that all equals to A Healthy Life yeah it's it's I think turned around yeah yeah nice yeah that's yeah yeah oh great yeah it's it's great to get uh it's nice that he he's young enough is still willing to listen to you you know yeah yeah absolutely yeah he's been he's been trying to school his teachers also oh yeah yeah well that's got that's that's going to be interesting how'd that go over uh well I mean he he he's doing it right now let's see I mean he's been telling them you know U listen to my podcast listen to others you know it's it's it's not just about the vegetables it's actually not about the vegetables and then he gets into discussions with his schoolmates who are all having a lot of vegetables you know don't want to say too much about that yeah yeah yeah that's funny well that's great um and uh how how long has uh your son been doing this too yeah I think about about a year now so yeah he he he eats yeah he eats what what what we eat sometimes he has a little bit of uh you know rice with his food but that's okay I mean he's still young but he knows that you know he can he can offset that later on MH yeah but he loves his chicken and his meats and goats and all yeah I mean he enjoys all of that yeah yeah nice and he's doing well he's doing well yeah I mean he works out with me I mean whatever you do yeah have you have you noticed much difference in your health and his health since you guys started yeah absolutely so I mean see I lost I lost my weight when I was doing ketogenic anyways right and uh but then when I when I look back onto the photos at that time I can see there was still a little bit of inflammation because uh I was still having a little bit of carbs uh at that time but I've definitely put on more lean muscle since I went car uh my my energy levels have really gone up uh since uh uh since since a year uh and I remember I mean I was I was having a conversation with Sarah also about priming uh when you go into carnal I remember my weight actually increased for the first three or 4 months and then started to come down again and now it's like settled at about I think 63 kilos or 64 kilos but I know that my fat percentage actually came down faster when I went into a full-blown carnivore diet uh rather than when I was doing ketogenic so yeah and I mean he's 8 years old he he's always energetic he's always been energetic but uh uh I I think he's got more stamina now cuz he plays football like twice a week twice twice a week and even when he comes back he's got lots of energy to keep playing and I think uh yeah I think we we'll see some more effects in him after a year two today was doing dumbbell curls he's never done that in front of me he's always been observing yeah yeah yeah take it easy yeah well it's going to be fun to see uh especially you know him and his and his peers because he's very likely going to grow a lot taller than them be more athletic than them always never struggle with his weight or mental I mean kids are always going to have sort of issues with h you know being sad and depressed and things like that but majority of mental health issues can be avoided hopefully and um you know and just see especially you got him you got him so young so like he's got he's just got all of puberty just to ramp this up which is G exactly yeah and I mean I mean the sad thing is that you know I mean there was a study that came out recently in India itself they've done ultrasounds for I think 8y olds to 18 year olds in rural city in in in India and 60% of them had non-alcoholic fatty liver disease yeah wow you know yeah so I mean that's the amount of carbohydrates and processed foods that you know are fed to children and uh which is quite sad I I remember one of uh one of the mother's groups from the school were actually discussing what you put in in the kids milks and they were all discussing about the chocolate syrups that you have and the strawberry syrups and and yeah that that that was all going on and they were like which one is the healthiest I really wanted to get in there and you know give them a lesson but I was like it's okay I don't want to start a controversy yeah I don't know if I would have I could have withheld like I would just been like which one's more healthy the chocolate syrup or this the strawberry none none of the syrups you know like U my goodness that's that's a shocking number I mean I remember the first cases of fatty liver disease in kids in America at least was were in the 1990s and that was back when it was called type or um adult onset diabetes and it was batty liver disease was exclusively uh seen in alcoholic populations and so they were shocked this these 10-year-old kids particular 10-year-old kid on the news um who had adult onset diabetes and fatty liver disease and they were like but he's not an adult how can a kid get adult onset diabetes how can he get fatty liver we only see that in Alcoholics and he's never had a drink in his life he's 10 and so instead of actually looking into it and thinking about this okay what changed they just said n it's probably always happening you know we just didn't didn't notice it it wasn't getting picked up and I guess you you could say that once but once you once you say okay now we're looking it should stay the same right but no it went up decade after decade after decade and it's still climbing and so it's it's uh you know a bit of a force to say that n it was always there I mean think about think about how um was a lot of people say no carbs carbs won't do that but how do we make fatty liver in other animals in like our in our livestock you know you force feed them grains you force feed them carbs and so you know why do we think this is going to be any different in us it's it's of course it's not going to we get marbling and beef and lamb and goat because we give them carbs yeah then and then we look at at uh MRIs and we just go like oh oh that myosis what's that about it's marbling that's human marbling and then you mention that you mentioned that to other people that we see this in MRIs we see this fatty deposits in in in muscle and that's just like marbling in cows is likely going to be from the same thing they oh how could that be like why would it not absolutely yeah yeah I mean they fatten them up to make the meat softer and it gets more expensive for us MH and if you're fat fattening them up obviously the organs are also going to you know fatten up and that's what happens and I mean it happens in humans also and it's happening at very young Ages which is actually not right for us I mean I just wipe off generations to come if if you know if if things keep going in this direction where you know where we actually start feeding sugars and Seed oils to infants in the baby formulas and and that's how you know most of them get addicted to the cup I mean I it was always a surprise to me as to why kids love sugar so much I mean CU you know none of us used to read the ingredients uh you know of these formula Foods uh in in the beginning you know the pediatrician would tell us that you know okay fine you vean them off start them with formula all right why not I mean supposed to be healthy for them mhm and even I've given it to my son uh cuz I had no idea at that time I would never read ingredients give some to him and then I you know and now you look back and you think why would they love sugar so much was because you know they were fed sugars uh when they didn't even know what food is all about and uh that's how early we've got them addicted to all of this food stuff yeah absolutely so as as an ER doctor you obviously you're seeing you know the front line of things going very wrong what is has that changed in uh you know since since you've been practicing medicine has has the character of problems of uh illnesses coming in change since you started medicine hey everyone really happy to announce a new sponsor for the show for everybody down in Australia Stockman steaks who are delivering highquality grass-fed and finished pasture raised beef and other meats flash frozen and vacuum sealed to Door something I've been enjoying a lot of myself recently as well they also have a great range of specialty items such as high fat keto mints and carnivore beef and organs mints with liver kidneys and beef heart as well so use code Shae today for free order of beef mints or another specialty gift along with your order at Stockman steaks.com and I'll see you over there thanks guys so I mean yeah I mean we we've been seeing the same spectrum of diseases but many more patients come in now and the the the age range has changed you know earlier you know things like Mis or heart attacks uh you know diabetes diabetic keto acidosis Strokes used to be diseases of the older age groups you know that's how we were taught but now we've been seeing I mean we've published a few papers where we had a 17-year-old come in with a heart attack we've had 35y old doctors come in with Strokes uh you know and uh and uh a l a lot of other young patients also coming in with uh with probably just an infection but they would have comorbid conditions of diabetes and hypertension and and coronary Ary disease already diagnosed and uh you know it's it's got me thinking as to why that's happening and we've had repeat patients come in you know somebody's had a heart attack and they come in again after a year or so with another heart attack and they say we've been taking all our medications you know we we get diabetic patients who were probably on some oral hypoglycemics they come in with some hypoglycemias or maybe diabetic keto acidosis and then you know they get admitted and then they get discharged on insulin they come after 2 weeks again and their insulin is increased and what what I've realized is that none of them are getting cured of these syndromes you know I mean as doctors we've actually become uh managers of the health conditions and we're not actually managing managing them really well because you know the amount of medications only keeps increasing uh I was talking to some nephrologists and we we get a lot of kidney kidney disease patients cuz we dialy them in in our emergency itself and I've seen over the years you know they come in with CKD stage one or two and they progress onto CKD Stage 5 end stage renal disease and then they're dialyzed and obviously I mean that's that's no life to live so what have we been doing nothing at all I mean no offense to any of the doctors because that's what that that's what we've been taught what medications to give what is the treatment so yeah we treat the acute phase even somebody comes in with a heart attack they they're stented they put on blood thinners they put in put on their aspirin and statins and all of that and they're discharged yes that acute phase has been taken care of we've saved their lives at that time but that is the only moment in time that we've saved the life you know I mean we don't know in the next two years they might just die off because the root cause was actually not addressed which is insulin resistance uh and the inflammation that they have because nobody addresses their diet they sent to dietitians for a balanced diet uh the dietitians have also been taught the same way that we've been taught we were not actually taught anyways but yeah so they put on moderation they still have their carbohydrates you know they have their complex carbs and simple carbs and all of that uh put them on grains uh fruits and some vegetables and stuff uh they're always told to avoid red meats uh and even egg yolks and then they actually come back and in a worse condition the heart keeps failing uh so yeah I mean and and the age range like I told you has actually gone down and uh I mean that's what I've been trying to tell people that you know I mean when you come into the miny Department you're actually coming in with a lot of complications of these metabolic syndromes or the complications of the medications that you're on because it's not well managed and a lot of patients who are actually not very compliant with their medications also so I've been trying to send out this message that help me save your life by actually not coming into the emergency department you won't need to come to the emergency department if you actually end up reversing your metabolic syndromes a lot of the patient footfall would go down a lot of resources would be saved a lot of money would be saved for the hospitals and for the patients yeah obviously if you have a trauma or an accident you need to come into to the Ed but then if you reverse your uh your metabolic syndromes you know you you you won't come in with accidented hypertension you won't come in with I uh which is brain hemorrhage like you know you won't come in with stroke Strokes you won't come in with heart attacks you won't come in with diabetic keto acidosis even infections you know communicable diseases you're not that suceptible if you're if you're actually metabolically healthy insulin sensitive your immunity is really high you're not going to catch infections so easily so you know you're not going to come in with that your recurrent we get a lot of patients with kidney stones recurrent U you know and people don't know about oxalates doctors don't know about about oxalates and the other antinutrients right so I mean I've had so many patients who come in with recurrent stones you know I've tried tried to counsel them you know regarding their food habits it's really really difficult for them to understand they're like it's all because of the calcium like no it's because of the oxalates you know they're the ones cating your calcium from your bones causing the stones you know and that's just the start lot of hypothyroid patients and a lot of cancers a lot of cancers we get so many cancer patients the complications of cancers you know the treatment when you chemotherapy is done you they get febril neutropenic a lot of patients who have metastasis and the symptoms of that so all of these are metabolic syndrome we know that even cancer is a metabolic syndrome you know your diet is really really important and uh yeah so I mean if people actually do reverse their metabolic syndromes they won't need to come to the emergency department and get the lives saved it makes life easier for everybody everybody I mean I have my uncle uh who was diagnosed with a renal tumor in January he's been a diabetic for 25 years and and a hypertensive he was on three medications uh and then in in January he was told that he need to start on insulin and get dialyzed because he had an acute kidney injury because of the real tumor I was like no ways we put him on a carnivore diet he started doing ketosis before his immune therapy uh which I'd got in touch with Professor C freed uh so he started doing that when when his it was time for his immunotherapy every 3 weeks in two months he was off all three medications for diabetes he was off his medications for hypertension and his second pet scan so this was in January and we got the second pet scan done in April his tumor size has actually gone down his lung Mets have disappeared his mediastinal uh Mets have actually reduced in numbers and size so that's like a really really positive uh outcome yeah and and he's completely changed him and his wife uh my aunt they're like you know this is all carnivore and ketosis this cannot be just a medication I was like yeah why not I mean you you've got off the the major the major thing is that your inflammation is is really down his even a CRP counts have been coming down even though he has a tumor he his CRP counts have been coming down which is actually quite uh quite surprising to see and yeah I'm writing up I'm writing up a case series of two three people that I've been treating so at least we get some scientific uh papers out there from the car Carnival Community there's very less I mean you have so many patients a lot of people have done really good with their patients but we need more Publications regarding this right so yeah I'm writing up some case series uh for this and so yeah so cancers again I mean if you if you're metabolically healthy you won't get cancers uh at least some of them uh and yeah so I mean that's what's happening in the emergency departments all over the world I think yeah yeah definitely and that's and that's the scariest thing this getting younger and younger like a 17-year-old kid having a heart attack it's absolutely shocking that that can happen and you know you hear some people you point this out I saw a doctor on you know Tik Tok of all places but you know he's he's got a big following and he's a he's a bariatric surgeon in America and he uh you know and he he just says you just very Hardline you know standard straight out of a textbook sort of stuff so you know can't really blame him for that but what you can blame him for is um you're making excuses for things when people point out the flaws right how there were no heart attacks in America or deaths from heart attack di you know proven on autopsy before 1912 we didn't see any of this stuff we treat heart disease and diabetes and cancer and all these sorts of things to any great extent Alzheimer's you know first described in 1906 and um and he sort of was watching this and and he sort of did like this re with like Paul saladino where he's pointing this out and he just goes Ah that's nonsense I mean people in the 1800s and before you know they just weren't living long enough to get these diseases and first of all that's absurd I mean just on its face and it doesn't even pass the smell test because the minimum age to run for president of the United States since the 1700s is 35 years old and so it's like people are oh people just died of old age in their 30s and like apparently not because you know the minimum age to run for president was 35 and I'm pretty sure we had a few presidents in the 1800s so um you know all the the founding American founding fathers they all like John Adams he died in 91 he was born in the mid 1700s he died in the mid 1800s and and the rest of the founding fathers unless they were killed by something generally lived to be you know in their 80s and 90s and so that was that was pretty typical I me you look at any sort of historical figure and just look how old were they when they died you know it's just it's that was that was just not a thing they lived very similar life expectancies it was just average life expectancy from birth was low because infant mortality rate was very high but this the way they kept statistics is if you made it to you know zero it was 38 in 1850 but if you made it to 10 on average you make it to 56 and on and on so as you became an adult you're more likely to live uh the ede that we do now so trying to make that argument is like well you know just dismissing this like not even thinking about this for a second shows such an un unscientific mind that they're just saying that like well no nothing to see here just being so closed off and uh and saying no can't possibly be anything except what I learned in medical school um is is very lazy thinking and looking that trying to make an excuse oh people just died people just died too early they just didn't live long enough well we know that's not true that's absurd but also now they're getting younger and younger and younger so now you get 17 year olds well people weren't living to 17 in the 1800s you know what the hell is that about how can you justify that sort of nonsense yeah the the the life expectancy in India right now 67 uh which is not very high and uh and our meat consumptions actually gone down from about 5.7 kgs per person per year which is really less that I eat that much in a week I think to about to about three kgs per person per year over the past 20 years kg a year yeah yeah yeah and uh and and and the deaths from non-communicable disease has actually increased from 30% to 60% over the past 20 years so it's it's an absolute inverse relation that that that's actually quite obvious if somebody goes through the data you know I just checking it out a few days back and I was quite surprised cuz you know we know that Hong Kong has the highest life expectancy right about 87 88 years or something like that and they have the highest meat consumption uh per capita in the world uh and then and then you look at a country and there are a lot of people who talk about the longivity factor in India yes we've I mean I remember we've we've had a lot of people who've who've actually uh you know lived on till about 90 and 100 absolutely and some of them have been really fit some of them were not as fit you know I remember uh I know a lot of grandparents who actually have Dawn to 8590 but they were I I don't remember playing around with them I don't remember uh them running around with us too much uh because I think they did not have uh the lean muscle that we we talk about that people should have they know they were more sarcopenic now that I look back um obviously they had fragile bones uh they also ended up with diabetes kidney disease all of that and it's not just about you know that the vegetarian food is going to help you live longer uh maybe it will in some people but then you also have to look at the quality of life uh we know a lot of uh people who actually end up in old age homes uh do are upen I mean and and then and it's not that they're roaming around freely in the old age homes you will have some exceptions yes but most of them are are either wheelchair bound or they they need help or you know uh they need nursing Aid so uh yeah definite meats are required it's really difficult to get to you know uh put that into the mindset of the people but I'm sure someday the ice is going to break I mean we just have to be repetitive uh to to do that and and and I think uh the mainstream media actually plays a role uh in this you know picking up these kind of story like like the melan randomization that just came out which says that meat does not cause any heart disease meat does not cause any cancer it was not picked up by any mainstream media none of them yeah I mean if they would have said the opposite it would have been breaking news all over the world but uh yeah nobody picked it up yeah yeah funny that it's up to I think yeah well it is I I actually just got a patient uh sent in she she got hold of something that's going to be talked about in the parliament uh here in in Western Australia basically trashing meat and how it's this is horrible for health and it's it's you know causes heart disease and cancer and diabetes literally said this in there and uh that it destroys the environment we have to go to Alternative protein sources it's all plant-based crap and how this can save the world and save the environment and and save our health and all this sort of nonsense um it's actually really disgusting so this this is being going not at a parliamentary level at a governmental level that they're trying to force this through because there's there's trillions of dollars backing it and we're spending trillions of dollars a year and that that's going to syn any system I we're just we're just completely destroying ourselves financially and from a health perspective all those dollars represent sick people that are living shorter lives and are being harmed by that and our economies are being harmed by that too because we don't have people that are that are healthy enough to work and they're on disability and they're not able to care for their families and all these sorts of things and so it's uh yeah it is it is just it's just G to be us and that's that's why we have to do that um you know I was going to say too you know what you were talking about with um only eating previously eating five kilos a year which I mean that sounds like a sandwich to me it's just that's like yeah shocked I actually ran through those numbers a few times like this can't be possible but yeah I mean it was yeah I was just like that year are we sure it's a year not a month not a not a week like weird yeah and and then dropping down to three kilos I mean that's that's shocking too so but that that's that's the thing that people say they say well if plant-based diets were so bad then how do you explain India yeah exactly you know yeah sorry go on yeah I mean uh that's what I've been thinking and uh so we we've started a couple of research projects in our department right so uh a lot of our patients who are coming in like I mentioned before have coorbit conditions they have diabetes hypertension heart disease hypothyroidism Cancer all of that so we started a survey uh which is going to go on for till till December next year and you know we're we're putting in uh we're asking all the patients who have comorbid conditions to let us know know what they eat uh and by what I mean first is the type of food they're eating vegetarian carnivore omnivore pescatarian anything and uh if they if they're not vegetarians or vegans uh we ask them how how frequently do they eat the eggs or the or the fish or or the meats and uh what what are companies that food and obviously we're also uh putting down if they have processed foods or not and their their drug habits any smoking or alcohol all of that and uh yeah we we're collecting all of that data and we've got about 350 patients already in in a month and it was I mean I wasn't that surprised 99% of them easily were vegetarians and the 1% who are Omni wars were actually eating Meats probably once a week uh if not more uh but yeah once a week to once a month and uh they were all accompanied by uh carbohydrates uh which is like the standard Indian diet you know I mean you have your chicken curries or your mutton curries and you you you load them with rice or roties I mean I still love doing that so so that's the standard Indian diet and it's full of uh carbohydrates but yeah 99% of these patients who are vegetarian uh they do not drink alcohol uh they're not smokus obviously there's going to be a little bit of bias when they're putting in that survey regarding the alcohol and the smoking I I can totally understand that but they will not lie about being a vegetarian because they all believe that a vegetarian diet is the healthiest diet so I know that is not going to be you know hidden from us regarding uh what they eat uh but yeah they might they might put in falsely regarding smoking or alcohol for sure they can that can happen but I'm I'm 110% sure anybody who's a vegetarian I mean there people who say you know there's uh The The J Community when they come and they're like you know I mean we eat really healthy food we don't even eat onions and garlic uh so that's how healthy we eat I remember we I had a 23-year-old who had come in and he had diabetes hypertension coronary AR disease and he had had a stroke earlier I was like what the hell are you doing to yourself I mean there's nothing healthy in what you're doing like I don't smoke I don't drink I'm like yes but you eating what you're not supposed to eat that is why you have all of these conditions you know at the age of 23 I mean if you 63 I could have still like okay fine I mean you lived half your life but at the age of 23 you had all of this uh so yeah I mean I'm I'm 110% sure what the results are going to be uh but yeah so I'm not doing the surveys so that no bias out it's my team uh you know every week to just give me an update as to what's happening and yeah that's I'm I'm not and I started this off why because uh we saw a lot of patients were coming in and I saw the positive effects in me my head of my department is probably my my best student who's actually following he started carnivore and in uh December and lost about eight or nine kgs he's off his anti-hypertensives so he's also become a big advocate of Carnival for his family and his friends uh but uh yeah so uh I I for the past seven or eight months I was asking every patient I was seeing what do you eat what do you eat what do you eat you know and every time the answer used to be I'm a pure vegetarian I'm a pure vegetarian and so I was like you know we need to get this data and we need the numbers so why don't we just start off project and yeah uh yeah let you know what happens by the end of next year yeah definitely yeah well that's really interesting and uh that'll be great when that comes out and and that's the thing you know if if vegans and vegetarians are supposed to be the healthiest people on Earth they're not supposed to get these diseases not supposed to get chronic disease they're not supposed to get metabolic syndrome and and metabolic illnesses or cancer and diabetes and heart disease or Strokes because of course that's caused by by uh meat and yeah and and saturated fat cholesterol and all these sorts of things they really shouldn't be in there you shouldn't you should only it should only be those people eating the three kilos of meat a year that should be coming in in your department but it's absolutely yeah and obviously I mean this is not a randomized control study we know the limitations of the study right I mean I'm not looking at the healthy patients or the Apparently healthy patients right I mean we're not I'm not these are the patients who are coming into my department I'm not going out into the community and even if I go out into the community if somebody says I don't not have Co mobbs how do they know they've never been tested right so I can't go out and test them and then say okay fine you're metabolically healthy what do you eat we're not doing that right now and I also know that we're not going to get too many carnivores probably probably no carnivores over the next two years be like except they don't need to come in because they're Healthy You So yeah so I mean uh uh so that's that's that's a little bit of a limitation that we have but but but the data is actually going to talk quite a bit cuz we'll have huge uh sample size about 7 to 8,000 that's what we're planning uh maybe hit 10,000 let's see yeah wellow yeah well that'd be huge and um you know obviously you know your Center sounds like you're seeing quite a lot large volume in India you know a lot of people so lot of people yeah yeah you got a lot of people to study too yeah that reminds me of something somebody told me that you know uh India has such a large population of course you're going to have the highest number of sick people I'm like why yeah if we the largest population we should have the highest number of the healthiest people why why the sickest people we should have healthy people why don't why can't we just work towards the positive and not the negative you know I mean just because we have the maximum numbers we should also have the maximum numbers of healthy metabolically sensitive patients oh people not patients but yeah people there yeah well also and and and and percentages right you know I mean like how what's the percentage of people getting sick you know so if you're if it it's just straight across the board this is the the percent around the world that people get cancer and it just doesn't change for anything like all right well it's just that's just something that happens but it is very different in different areas and different uh in different regions and under different conditions so obviously there are environmental factors that go into this yeah absolutely I mean uh there was a systematic review that came out which said that India has 30% of the population which has a diagnosed metabolic syndrome and another 30% that are probably pre-diabetic so that's 60% of the population that's sick anyways yeah uh yeah but I think I think in every household that I know there is either a hypertensive or a diabetic patient yeah Jes I think in every household yeah I mean everybody I know if if I can if I can actually look back or you know just probably make a tree or something like that of all the people I know there would be somebody in the family who has one metabolic syndrome for sure yeah and and you said 30% have diab abetes yeah that's amazing I mean so so like America it's like N 9 10% have diabetes right T I mean so I mean that that's incredible so and and we blame America a lot of junk food in America it's it is you know we eat we eat a plant-based diet in America and in in Australia and Europe it's just a pro more processed food plant-based diet and even then and we eat meat and and even then you know we have a very high diabetes right higher than it's ever ever been increased by over a fact I think it's six to Eightfold increase since the 1970s and 80s in America there a massive massive increase and um and and they blame that on the meat you obviously Harvard Dr Willet came out saying that know diabetes is is um caused by red meat or is associated with red meat and then but there you go you know like Wella they're all plant-based they're more mostly plant-based over in in India and uh how you explain that how well I think that does explain it 30% diabetes rates three times the diabetes rate of the Fat Sick Americans that everybody in the entire world laughs at from a health perspective yeah yeah I'll send you the paper I mean offline it's pretty amazing yeah I mean so I think the the the study population that taken were about about I think 300,000 people or something like that uh they had studied uh the RCs uh regarding this but yeah I I'll send knew the paper across yeah yeah absolutely um so yeah that that sort of begs the question you know the apart so apart from that you know do you know like the rates of like U of cancers and other sorts of non-communicable chronic diseases and those sorts of things and and more importantly um I think of this in the context of life expectancy you know you said the life expectancy is on average from birth 67 years but in that time period in the last 20 years we started eating less meat and there's more metabolic disease has that affected life expectancy as well uh I'm not sure about the numbers yet but I do know that deaths in India due to non-communicable diseases and the ncds and the metabolic syndrome is actually uh increased from 30% to 60% wow yeah so 60% of the debts in India are because of complications of ncds and metabolic syndromes which includes your cardiac diseases your diabetes cancers all of that yeah so I I'm not sure about the life expectancy that the life expectancy two years back was 67 uh years mhm I don't know where it was earlier not sure about the numbers I'll check it up but yes this was surprising that actually not surprising but the numbers actually spoke for themselves because earlier was 30% uh of the deaths in India were because of ncds now it's 60% that's St hey guys just want to take a second to thank our sponsor at carnivore bar I don't promote many products because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat for those times that you're out hiking road tripping or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat fat and salt if you want it the carnivore bar is a great option so I like this product not because it's just pure meat but also because I want the carnivore Market to thrive as well and the more we support meat only products the more meat only products there will be available in the mainstream so if this sounds like something You' like like to get behind check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off which also applies to subscriptions giving you 25% off total all right thanks guys yeah and obviously and we see a lot of we see a lot of cancer patients for sure I don't know the numbers but a lot of them you go to any uh super Speciality Hospital in India which has an oncology center you'll see you know throngs of patient coming in with uh Cancers and the complications yeah yeah well that was a that was a uh paper that came out from Harvard School of Public medicine talking about the ncds the non-communicable chronic diseases and they just looked at at five of them so cancer heart disease COPD diabetes mental health and they looked at how much we were spending across the world just to treat these things the direct and indirect cost of treating the just those five diseases and it was it was so upwards of like eight trillion dollars seven or eight trillion dollars in 2010 around the world and in 2030 it's expected yeah expected to go up over $ 13 trillion do so it's nearly doubling what we're spending on this you know and so the idea I mean we we've never been more technologically advanced we've never had known more than we do right now at least in books uh although you know we we we've fooled ourselves and forgotten a lot of things that are very important and and and that's where we're in the trouble that we're in I think and yet from a medical science point of view we we never had better interventions than we have now and yet more people are getting sick more people are dying and uh and like you said the the mortality rate of these chronic diseases are increasing and so like with cancer is you know that's it's just getting more more and more prevalent COPD all these sorts of things are getting harder and harder to deal with and people can say well the treatments are getting more expensive because we're getting new treatments because you always get new treatments and that yeah that's fair enough however they've also calculated this in you know uh time lost and uh you know lost sick days and lost production and um lost productivity and things like that and that's estimated to have lost the economy World economy nearly 47 trillion doar between 2011 and 2030 and then the most important one was the cost of Premium mature deaths people dying young and how much this cost you know someone has 17-year-old kid dies from a heart attack and like that's his entire lost productivity for the rest of his life some you know somebody dies in their 30s and they they leave their their family unable to care for themselves and they have to figure out what to do those costs of people just dying early was estimated in 2010 to be uh upwards of 22 trillion nearly 23 trillion dollars a year worldwide and in two by 2030 they expect that to go up to nearly 43 trillion dollars a year that we're spending on just excess deaths and early deaths because failing to uh to get a hold of this yeah that's that's absolutely insane I mean there's so much of money being put in U for uh treating patients but not curing them yeah I mean none of these medication companies are actually sitting in their boardroom And discussing how how should we reduce the medications on a patient you it's always how do we sell more yeah yeah and people are buying yeah and and they they're spending so much of money I mean I remember I I and if you go carnivore a lot of people think me's going to be more expensive you know as a lifestyle uh but it's actually not I mean I mean we had a helper in our department and her husband was diagnosed with diabetes his HP once he was 11 or something and I gave her two options I mean either you go to an endocrinologist start off on medications you try carnivo and they actually did it and you know his sugar levels fell down from 430 to 100 uh fasting in like a month and his hp1 from went down from 11 to 7 yeah obviously you're cutting off junk foods and carbs that also people need to understand uh it's not just about the meats you're cutting off all the cars carbohydrates and sugars but then you're actually adding on a lot of nutrition also yeah you know a lot of anti-inflammatory properties that Meats have uh all the all the proteins that we need the saturated fats that we need you know even if you go vegetarian and vegan a lot of people have reversed their Diabetes by you know cutting off all the major carbohydrates and sugars but then they end up with other deficiencies and other illnesses and other sicknesses obviously but yeah I mean and and and this guy was able to sustain himself uh on the Z because he used to like his meat so he started having it in every meal that he was having and uh actually got better without medications so and he could afford it that's the main thing he could afford to actually eat that ways yeah difficult yeah well I mean eating meat is generally more affordable than uh diabetes medications yeah absolutely yeah and dying young you know I think I think most things are cheaper than yeah exactly and once you're diagnosed your insurance company premiums go up you know and then people probably don't don't you know end up I mean they end up not paying their premiums they're like you know it's too expensive for us and then they get into complications and then they can't pay for that uh you know once they get all the complications and it's a whole vicious cycle I mean it's so so much easier to actually get off all the medications and not end up in the emergency department yeah definitely and um well that's great that um you're getting people to do that so have you have you been trying to to obviously it's sort of difficult you you're doing Acute Care in the ER so you don't have the luxury of sitting down with someone for half an hour and really getting into it um but have you been able to sort of incorporate this into your practice and is that uh is that legal where you are you allowed to allowed to do that I think as as doctors everybody all the doctors are allowed to give lifestyle advices I mean you know I mean I don't tell them that you know uh stop having your medications and eat food what I tell them is all right you continue your medications for the time being but then incorporate this also into your lifestyle and then wait and watch probably your medications will be stopped by your primary physician himself once your reports are all okay you know I mean I mean if your hb1c comes down to four there's no reason he should put you on neural hypoglycemics or your insulin right so I mean but yeah people who are close to me my family and friends they get the I mean I've put them uh off medications uh I didn't even start medications for some of them you know for diabetes for hypothyroidism there another one who's who has fatty liver uh and this is great to fatty liver so yeah I'm treating her with the carnivore diet and she's actually feeling a lot better I'll get to know her results in the next and sometime this month so yeah family and friends they're not going to sue me anyway so so that's okay and for my patients yeah I mean I don't have the time to sit with them there's some of them who are actually very receptive and then they there are some who who actually used to eat meats and then turned vegetarian and started having problems and this is what they tell me themselves you know you're actually right when I started become started eating only vegetarian uh my health actually started to deteriorate yeah so you know they they made me write down a chart for them which is very easy what should I eat these six items you can eat these in whatever form you want use these oils or ghee and butter and all that to cook no seed oils and that's about it and see how you do uh continue your medications tell your primary physician tells you to stop them uh or if you want to follow up with me I mean I give them the option but yeah none of them men come come back into the Ed because I don't have consultations in in the in the Ed uh but uh yeah a couple of them are in touch with me and they're doing better but I've asked them to follow up with their primary physicians yeah yeah yeah oh that's really good and so you got your your head of department on it that's great is the have you sorted toppling the other dominoes around your department too yeah we're trying we're trying I mean there are a few vegetarian ones you know I I always tell them as a joke you look at your future you know when when yeah so that's a nice one that's that goes on a few of them yeah they've I mean they've not they didn't do their Residency program right so it's very difficult for them to chart out and sit and eat only because they have varied timings and all of that uh but uh I think they're trying once they once they clear their final exams and all probably they'll have more money and more time to actually sit down and take care of uh the nutrition uh there are a few vegetarians they're very Stern about it uh because they've been vegetarian all their life they've actually understood yes what they're doing is not going to help them uh too much in the future life but uh it's very difficult to convert into when omnivore forget about carnivore so yeah but we'll keep trying I mean can't help it yeah we have a lot of numbers yeah well I mean that's the thing you you found something that works you you see something that's uh you know scientifically rigorous you know that that this actually has some real scientific value behind it and and and and it's working it's working for you it's working for your patients it's working for millions of people literally millions of people around the world at this point it's it's it's actually pretty impressive you know you have these different you know groups along the internet you have different channels like you know yours and mine and Dr Bakers and saladinos and Dr Barry's you reaching millions and millions of people and uh and the vast majority I mean my my channel is only about the carnivore dieet so I'm sure people follow me because they I don't assuming the the comments you get like there's there's a couple little hecklers like every now they're like the same person they're just it's angry just every single time it's just like you know why are you following me if I just make you so angry you know but and you you don't have to comment back cuz you know you have this whole Community behind you and they're the on to them yeah that's the best part I love that when I go through the comments I'm like you know we don't even need to comment cuz there's so many others who there to you know help you out whatever I mean you don't even need to entertain them yeah no it is good I mean sometimes I do wait in just because um you know sometimes people saying things it's just like that that's a flat out lie well know that and um so I call them out on it but it's um but you know for the most part you know people that are following these channels you know that they're they're they're interested in carnivore and they're doing carnivore and they're getting benefited by it so you know we have we have people that have very large channels you know numbered in the millions uh multiple millions and um and people and you look at the comments on these these these videos and it's just person after person after person after person who has had significant benefit reversed significant disease burdens by doing this and so it's uh it's not something that like you can just keep to yourself in all good conscience right you see someone suffering from something and it's like how can you not say that I I had a lady today who had just point after point after point it was just like all of this stuff you know she had like rheumatoid arthritis she had fibromyalgia she had residual pain from uh sciatica surgery and and radiculopathy she had suffered from migraine she had diabetes um it was just like one after that I'm like look everything here is going to be improved just by changing your diet and I sort of went through that with her but I was just like this is just like I mean this is just free points right here I mean this is just like abely you can't mess this up like this could completely revolutionize your life and um how do you not say that you know so I understand you know yeah yeah I do that with all my patients now you know when I meet them and and they have these issues and you know I just speak with them like you know what do you eat and they're like this and and uh you know I mean I just have to tell them you know what you've been doing is actually obviously not working out for you you know why don't you try something else you know this is what I do look at me I show them my photos my team shows them my photos like it's all over you know our photographs are all over the department right so this is what he looked like look at him right now you know there's so much of change listen to him try it once you know I mean see how you feel so yeah we do that so and yeah the links to the podcast and everything is is you know sent to the patients so that attendance the families and all uh and yeah I mean somewhere somebody might be getting inspired to you know follow us and just or follow the right path uh to Caro yeah well that's the that's sort of the idea and hopefully well it sounds like you're already you're already making a lot of um changes very positive changes in people's lives and and even though it's it's limited in how much time you get to spend with them to talk about this you know clearly you've made an impact you you've already found that you've followed up with some of these these people and they're already improving I love that that um idea of saying look I can send you to an endocrinologist you can take medications for the rest of your life or you can change your diet what do you want to do that's a great approach yeah yeah yeah is going to be a work in progress yeah Dr uh Dr Unwin David Unwin over in in the UK he's he's a GP there and that's and that's what he tells him he said listen whatever you want to do I can put you on these medications you're going to be on on them for the rest of your life and this is going to continue to get worse or you can change your diet and just eat less carbs you know you doesn't doesn't necessarily Go full carnivore just eat less carbs just go low carb or no carb and and you'll reverse that what do you want to do it's one or the other you know and he said and he said every single one has chosen the diet instead of and the medication so you just give people a chance you know they they they get to choose I mean that's the whole point of informed consent right it's just like hey what do you want to do here are the options here are the risks here the benefits do that's what we should be doing as doctors really he's lucky you know cuz they chose the diet because as you know people are actually addicted to carbs you know carb addiction is is an actual thing I mean I've had actually people tell me that you know I'd rather have my sweets and take my insulin short you know enough yeah yeah they do that yeah they do that all right I mean I tried yeah yeah well that's the thing that people don't realize you know there there's all this um you know trying to to minimize the effect in the role that insulin has in our body it's a it's a very active hormone as you know and people try to say like well you know carbohydrates you know you just you eat sugar and your your blood sugar goes up and then insulin goes up correspondingly and it you know drives into cells it's a normal process what supposed to happen uh not at those levels you know it's not supposed to it's not supposed to be massively elevated uh blood sugar and massively elevated insulin these are out of balance when your blood sugar goes up it causes damage to your body it's called glycation This is what kills diabetics we know this when di when blood sugar just goes up just a little bit above that Crest it becomes very toxic to the body and that's why the insulin's going up so there actually is damage happening to the body the whole time but then if it was just insulin just put energy carbohydrates and protein into cells that would okay well got a little bit of damage but all right not that big of a deal problem is of course that insulin does so many more things than just drive uh you know energy into cells it has it's it's responsible for at least effects over 100 different processes in the body and that's what I try to tell people it's it's not just about controlling the blood sugar you got to control the insulin as well the insulin being too high is going to affect everything at that heighten level and that's and that's completely out of balance and your body gets out of balance your metabolism gets out of balance and that that causes harm long before you get the damage from the from the sugar absolutely absolutely I mean uh people need to and even a lot of endocrinologists actually don't know that they should test the insulin levels fasting and I I I would suggest PP also post pandal after Foods uh because you also want to see how much insulin is secreted once you taken in uh you know some food uh but yeah I mean just hp1c and and your fasting sugars is not going to help you diagnose forget diagnosing rule out diabetes that's not going to happen you need to know if the patient is walking towards uh insulin resistance that's that's really important it's also a driver for inflammation so yeah really really important yeah I I actually just saw a patient today and his his blood sugar was you know 0.1 above what you know the reference ranges here would say that that's okay it's higher than I want it uh but for that reference range is just a little blip above and um and he said that he went to his GP and GP said yeah yeah yeah levels are fine you know there's no diabetes or anything like that um but then you know I checked his fasting insulin fasting insulin and here with the you know the numbers um really the range should be you should never be above nine really I like to see see it more around you know 2 to S but you know really don't want that above nine and his was 44 know so I was like he well my doctor said I was fine I was like no you know this is this is show your body's compensating is and um but it's it's getting very overwhelmed and um it's having to really really really work very hard to keep your blood sugars just struggling where they are and they and you know just tipping above the Horizon now so that's you were compensating for it now you're it's decompensated and so now that's that's starting to go up and this is this is only going to go in One Direction unless you you know completely change everything and um yeah and I see it again and again I mean I had a guy um largest I've ever seen in my life is his fasting insulin was 72 and that was pretty impressive fasting yeah I mean he he had fasted for 24 hours he's like yeah I didn't eat for 24 hours you know and so he um and so you know imagine what that was post prandial but um I knew a lot of other sorts of things wrong obviously and I think six weeks we checked his Bloods again and it was already down to 35 on a six weeks on a carnivore died you know and and he was losing you know plenty of weight and and getting better in a lot of ways too AB absolutely remarkable what this does for people yeah absolutely you must be feeling fantastic about that yeah now it's good well that's what they saying I was like you know when is when is a diet not a diet you know this is a medical intervention and we need to start thinking about that as as doctors and patients this is a medical intervention it's not just ah you need to go on a diet and lose some weight no it's a medical intervention you need to eat in a very different way to bring about a different medical outcome and I think that's a very important way of of phrasing this and getting you and relaying that and teaching that to people yeah absolutely I think it's it's a lifestyle uh once once you get into this it totally becomes a a lifestyle a carnival lifestyle and uh I have a few friends uh who I put on Carnival and we went for a we went for a friend's wedding and it was a vegetarian wedding we none of us ate I know I was so happy I was so proud of them because I knew I was going to eat I I actually pregamed with a lot of fats and eggs and all that before we went and uh yeah I mean I was really taking a back that all right these guys are actually following it they went home and they ate after that so it was pretty cool yeah yeah good well that's awesome well um I was gonna say so you got the you got the study coming up what's uh what's what what does the future hold for for Dr Verma yeah so yeah I mean I mean I've been joking around with my with my team that uh you know if this actually works out you know and we get a lot of more people who are actually working on carnivore who want to go into the diet I might just leave emergency medic no ways you know you can't quit emergency medicine I me if that was I mean yeah yeah but uh I'm going to I'm going to Advocate as much as possible uh regarding the carnivore diet uh trying to help a lot as many people as I can I mean that's what we became doctors for and I totally understand how many patients or people we've actually harmed at least I have by giving them the wrong diet advice uh a lot of them I I've you know told them so many times you know have moderation or have have your proteins and carbs in moderation I've actually told people to avoid red meats uh when uh when their lipid profiles were deranged and now I know I mean your lipid profiles don't matter too much your triglycerides and HDL is what what's important uh but yeah I'm just going to keep advocating I can't push anybody I can't I can shove meat down their throats but uh yeah I'm just going to keep talking about it and and uh probably try and support them as much as possible even if they can't go full carnival at least cut off uh the junk foods and I'm been trying to tell my friends who have kids that you know it's not okay to normalize junk Foods uh for your kids just because we've had them as kids doesn't mean we're going to feed that to our kids I've done that to my son but now he doesn't even remember the junk Foods he's eaten so so that's that's a good thing he doesn't even ask for it uh it's just erased from his it might be in his subconscious mind somewhere and come out in the next 40 50 years probably in a dream or something yeah but yeah I mean I I I keep hopping to my friends that it's not okay to normalize junk food not just for adults but majorly for the kids uh and yeah so podcast my Instagram I mean I use my Instagram a lot uh I am on X but don't use that too much especially not for this I use that more for emergency medicine uh but not for carnivore right now and uh yeah I mean let's see uh let's see how many patients I get how many how many lives I can turn around yeah lot yeah well I think I think it's I think it's just going to keep getting bigger and bigger especially with you know people on the ground there you know but I noticed I have 11% of my followers on YouTube and Instagram are from India and so you know that's a significant amount and um you know I've I've noticed that there's there's more and more interest uh over there and certainly there's there's a lot of people that could use it you know I mean 30% diabetes rate that just goes away yeah yeah absolutely and I mean I'm always going to put out that you know I can save their lives without them coming to the Ed it's not required we we don't require to save your lives you can actually do it yourselves uh by eating right and following the correct lifestyle yeah well it's great to have you have you over there advocating for this and getting getting you know more people um that uh you don't have access to uh you know my podcast I mean a lot of people in this world that don't speak English and I I don't speak anything but English so you know it's it's great to have you know more people uh like yourself in India and elsewhere you know just just you know fighting the good fight and just putting this out there to people because uh you know we need it you know we were the fattest and sickest we've ever been in human history and and and we are and the powers that be are spending billions of dollars uh pushing us hard in that direction of of illness as opposed to in the direction of Health but saying that I mean they're just gaslighting the hell out of us saying that the thing that's causing us to get sick is oh that's actually the thing that's going to save you oh you know that thing you've been avoiding and getting more sick as a result of it no no that that's what was doing it you know no no it's like it's like Homeopathy like less is more like the less meat you eat it gets more potent you just have to get rid of all of it you know and um it's uh it's really important to keep fighting that so I appreciate you doing that work Buddy you thanks thanks Anthony I'm and you've been doing some amazing work also you know being a neurosurgeon uh and and I mean you've got so many mill I mean millions of people who following you I keep I I listen to your podcast your YouTube and you know just amazing work you've been I think six seven years Caro now maybe more uh and uh you you've touched so many lives and like like the other doctors who are there and uh the other coaches whove who who've gone carnivore and they're advocating the same thing so yeah I think as a community we're all doing a good job uh uh we just need to continue doing that I think yeah yeah definitely that's great man well thank you very much uh for coming on man that was a great conversation and I'm sure everyone got a lot out of that and sort of debunked the the myth of the healthy uh subcontinent of of vegan India so thank you very much for that uh please do tell everybody where they can find you and your about your podcast and Instagram and social media that's been a pleasure Anthony thank you so much for having me here uh uh they can follow me on my Instagram which is a n ksv uh that's my Instagram handle and uh my my podcast is the da em Dei em project uh uh that's on Spotify Apple and Google podcast so yeah people can listen in over there and um follow what we do on Instagram awesome thank you so much not a problem man I'll put all those links in the description so if people would like to uh see more head down and you guys can check out our interview on uh on Dr Burma's podcast as well which was great too so uh thank you very much it was great to see you and uh thank you all for joining and listening I hope you found that useful and if you liked it please do uh leave a comment letting us know what you thought and if you had any sort of issue with uh with your health that you've been able to reverse with a carnivore diet please do leave a comment and let people know about that because that really helps people understand that that this is real people doing this and finding this and if you see that and you say like well actually that's something I have um people are much more likely to be inspired to try it so uh do know that your sphere of influence in your own personal life and the comments you leave and the interactions you make online and in real life make a huge difference in other people's lives so thank you all for the work that you're doing too we'll see you next time hey guys thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say if you like it then please like And subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcast and if you're on YouTube then please hit that little bell and subscribe and that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out which should be every week if not more and if you can share this with your friends that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing thanks again guys