"The BEST Thing I've Done For My Body? Going CARNIVORE." - Joy Villa

[Music] Hello everyone. Thank you for joining me for another episode of the PlantFree MD podcast. I'm your host Dr. Anthony Chaffy and uh today I have a very special guest, Mrs. Joy Vila, who is an actress, a recording artist, and a uh well a fitness um enthusiast and trainer and is coming on to tell her tell us her fitness journey and health journey. Joy, thank you so much for coming on. It's a pleasure to see you. Yeah. Thank you, Dr. Plantfree MD. I love it. Um, so for for people who haven't come across you before, can you tell us a bit about yourself and what you do? Yes. So, I um actually was a vegan for 25 years. I was plant-based and I just now got into the carnivore diet. I am a personal trainer. I'm a Billboard recording artist. I hit number one on Billboard, iTunes, Amazon. I've toured 39 countries. I've lived overseas in six countries. Um I I have a very wide variety of things I'm into. And so I, you know, I'm an author as well. And one of the things is I competed in bikini bodybuilding, plant-based. I had my own vegan fitness company for years, which I've now turned into a holistic nutritional company. I'm a holistic nutritionist, personal trainer, and owner and creator of Joy Villa Fitness. Very good. That's it's very Yeah, it's always interesting. How did um how did how was the reception and we'll get into why you changed and everything like that and your experiences but I'm always interested like because you were not only doing vegan but you were obviously putting yourself out there. You had a vegan uh you know food and fitness company sort of thing. I was into it. How's that? Yeah. How's that reception with it with this transition? Because sometimes there's there's quite a lot of push back. Yes. So, it's interesting because I was so used to the haters, you know, people like I I'm I'm no stranger to controversy, you know, you know, I'm very outspoken and the Make America Health Vegan Again movement and the MAGA. I'm like very So, I'm I'm used to controversy. So, vegan was just another thing that people could hate me for, right? So, I'd be like, "No, I'm vegan." And I was educated. So, I read all the papers, all the white papers, all the studies. I'm like, "Absolutely." you know, which I thought at that time were accurate and factual and I was helping people. So, if people would push back on veganism at that time, I was like, "That's okay." You know, I'm still going to help you. Flipping into being a meat eater when I announced I was actually so scared for a year, I didn't say anything because I didn't want people to know because I said, "Okay, I have sponsorships being a vegan. I have uh you know people I've worked with companies, friendships that I built through the vegan community and I'll never forget um I went out to this meeting this meet up with this with a with a group of people and there was this guy and he was a British guy and he was really cool. We struck up a conversation. He's like, "Yeah, this is it it's a vegan meetup, right?" So I was like, "Okay, cool. Vegan meetup in Florida." And he showed me his tattoo and it said vegan on his arm, like huge. And I'm like, "How long have you been a vegan?" And he says, "Oh, I've been a vegan for for two years now." And I'm like, "And you got that tattoo?" I'm like, "I was a vegan for 25 years and I never would have got a" and I'm covered in tattoos. Nothing that says vegan because you can't. And I was even already like, "Okay, I think I'm going to get out of this cult. I don't think this is for me." You know, it was starting to unravel. But I said, "Well, if I say anything and then so finally I said something, I announced it on my social media and I got tons of hate from vegans disappointed me. I used to trust you and now I had a vegan fitness company called the Fit and Sexy Vegan, which we now turned into Joy Villa Fitness." So I was already being like, "Okay, it's holistic. I got my certification. You don't have to. I train clients of all different types and food." So, I was already starting to condition my audience to see that it's not just about veganism, but the vegans came out strong. They they attacked me. They're like, "I can't believe you're now into killing animals." And then my brother, who's still a vegan, you know, he just of course has to get on my nerves. He's like, "I can't believe you did that." And but he's he's playful. He's he's not a hater. But I look at all these people who attack me and I I click on their profile pictures. Their skin looks bad. they're painfully underweight or overweight, you know, they have acne. And I was always one of the healthiest vegans I knew because of supplementation and diet and exercise. I was very rigid with that. But most people can't do that kind of lifestyle. Most people aren't, you know, as obsessed and and the fact that you have to be that rigid to follow your eating shows that it's not really the way nature, the way God intended us to eat. You know, that was my revelation. And so now I just I just say, "Hey, I got love for everybody." But I think most of the vegans have been a bit quiet. I'm sure after this comes out, this podcast episode comes out, the haters are going to get riled up again. That's okay. Probably. Yeah. Bring it on. That's funny. Yeah. But I mean, you think about it, and you're talking about what we're, you know, designed to eat. If you have to take supplements, then by definition, your diet is deficient and not what we're designed to eat because we're not designed to need supplements. No matter what we are, we're not supplemental wars. Like we we're not designed to just eat supplements and things like that. Yeah. If you have to do that, then your diet is a bad diet. It's not a good diet. It's not satisfying your demands. Now, you may have malnut malabsorption issues or or something else. You may need a bit more um more nutrient density or something like that. Um organs, you know. So, I mean that I mean that's a solution for that sort of thing. I mean if someone has like supernicious anemia where they they they are not capable of absorbing B12 and they need sublingual or or injections that's that's different that's a medical condition that's not a biological design you know that's not and that's not a a nutritional design flaw because there is B12 in in meat it's just that your body can't extract it um because there's there's a medical condition. So, but I used to say that right to meat eaters who would tell me, "Oh, B12 deficiency and all this." I said, "Well, everybody has a B12 deficiency. Meat eaters should supplement. I was big on supplementation because you have to be you have to be indoctrinated as a vegan that this is normal that this is how because otherwise your whole your whole food eating plans fall apart." And I was very much into veganism for health. I was I used to say I was vegan for all the reasons. Yes. No animal cruelty. I'm still anti-an animal cruelty, right? I get farm raised, pasture-raised, right? I mean, most people who eat meat I know are anti- cruelty and we want to get the antibiotic free, you know, fresh farm raised, natural, humanely slaughtered, but that, you know, for them, for vegans, it's it's very much a religion and it's very much it doesn't matter if you're eating French fries because I used to say just because you're vegan doesn't mean you're healthy. You know, French fries and cigarettes are vegan. Yeah. And I know a lot of those French fries cigarette vegans, but in their mind, it does it's not about health. It is about animals, saving the animals, but it's not really about saving the animals. Cuz if you dissect what else they do, and if you go, okay, well, what about this? Could you do this? And what about farming? How it kills a lot of bugs? And then they say, nope. Listen, I'm better. I'm moral. You're hurting people. I'm I'm the righteous one. And that's really what it's about. That's why I do believe veganism is a cult because they're all about feeling righteous. Like that guy, he's like, "Oh my, I got my tattoo." He had some severe mental health problems. I found out, you know, and I was like, "Are you going to handle that?" No. Yeah. No, I'm just going to exercise and be vegan and not hurt animals. I'm going to be fine. He was avoiding his own mental health issues by being vegan. And that's the problem. It's not just about a diet. It becomes a religious philosophy. becomes a moral superiority argument. It becomes I'm better. And I felt that when I was vegan, I'll tell you. I was like, "Yeah, I'm eating better than these people." You know, this is what it feeds you. So, I'm anti all of that crap now, which is funny because I'm anti anti that closeted um bubble mindset, that bubble thinking. I think all of us should look at the opposite of whatever we aspouse is the best. experiment, do your studies, look at it, and then make up your mind for yourself. I think that's a really good way of looking at it. And and you know, I always, you know, want people to say it's like, don't take my word for it. You know, listen to what I have to say. You know, put out this information. You I have guests on, they have their side of things, and I have, you know, doctors, professors, uh, researchers, and you put published data on and say, "Okay, you look at it. This is what we're basing this on. You take a look at that and you see what you think and make up your own mind and and look at the opposite. Look what they're saying. Listen to their arguments. Look at their evidence and listen to our arguments and and look at our evidence. Make your own decision. You're an adult. You know, totally get to do that. And so, yeah, people forget they're an adult, though. They forget. Well, yeah. And then and they just close themselves off, you know. I mean when when I when I was researching this I I sort of had that that epiphany like hold on a second you know just humans just that's just the kind of animal we are and animals need to eat to their biological design that's every single form of life on earth you know plants need certain inputs they need certain things in the soil they need certain exposures to light they need certain atmospheric conditions in order to thrive and get and meet their requirements for life we have that too and there's certain things that are toxic to different forms of life. And so that applies to us as well. We are not outside of that. You know, we're not we're not angels coming down from heaven where this is just this is just the material world and we're just above it. Like no, sorry. We are actually of this world and we need to respect its laws. And so I started looking into this and saying, "Okay, well, what's the evidence for this? What can we prove?" And and and all that. And I I knew from my own personal experience because for 5 years I did this. I just avoided plants. And that was my my whole litmus test is like if it has a plant I'm not eating it. Like that's it. Incredible discipline for five years. Like how many people can do a test for five years. Yeah. Well, and yeah. Well, it was like, you know, just, you know, my my professor just talk told how toxic plants were and I'm just like, yeah, no, I'm not touching it. And and I just felt amazing. And um and then I sort of slipped off of it, you know, because I wasn't I wasn't doing something specifically. It was just that one, literally one lecture, one day that just changed everything for me. And then you get this constant inundation of, oh, you need vegetables, you need this, you that I'm like, yeah, really? Oh, but they've got anti-ve it's good against cancer. I'm like, yeah, but I don't have cancer, so I don't know why I need a chemotherapy agent. And um, mushrooms have carcinogens. So I'm like, what would, you know, just because it has a good thing doesn't mean it doesn't have bad things as well. And and again, it's good if you have cancer, but I don't have cancer. So, you know, is this actually providing any benefit for me? And and so that was always like, well, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. But you're just getting inundated, you know? Oh my god. Yeah. We get so inundated. I mean, the the standard American diet, right? I mean, which is just it's it's awful. It's sad. It's horrendous. It's like eat a bunch of grains, eat a bunch of plants, stay away from fats, you know, limit your fats. uh you know, but it's okay to have a Diet Coke because that's a healthy. Like, it's just crap. We're starting to find out all of these toxic chemicals, all of this toxic stuff that's been in our food, all of these ideas, and a lot of these studies are published by companies that make money, right? It's like, why are we pushed all this stuff? Because General Mills published studies that cereal is great for you in the morning. Well, what did they have to gain? You know, trillions of dollars. So it's it's it's amazing too to talk to somebody from the medical community, a medical doctor like you who was like, "Wait a second. Food can be our medicine. You know, you probably would rather somebody eat healthy and exercise than see you sometimes because they probably could have had a lot of those issues avoided." Mhm. Yeah. Well, I mean, I always tell my my patients that, you know, like our practice model is to get them the education and resources that they need to not need to come back and to just just go out there and be healthy and like only only come in if there's if there's a problem, you know. Yeah. Yeah. and um you know or if they need like a you know annual checkup or something or if they if they do need to be on on certain medications or something like that then we just need to see them periodically to make sure they're okay and do some blood tests and things like that you know depending on what they're on. So, but overall just be healthy because you can. And that's, you know, we've been we've been sort of fooled into thinking that the that we're all just broken, shattered creatures and we're just dying and getting diseased and our body's just supposed to break down. Is not natural. God did not create us to be diseased. You know, our creator created us to have perfect working bodies if we work with our bodies and we listen to our bodies. And I also believe sometimes sickness is rest, right? Because we need rest. If you if you go without sleep and you're putting a bunch of caffeine and so I mean I know I've had my adrenals adrenals like stressed and blown out because I'm tired from eating carbs and I'm eating all this stuff and you're trying to and then you're like this and it's a rat race. It's like this this rat race of trying to to eat something healthy, but then you get tired after you eat it and you know you shouldn't. So then you take some caffeine and then you know, okay, but it's a constant chaos. And so I've only been I've been eating meat for a year now. Um, and I've been carnivore for 30 days. Hey, look at that. Hey, exactly. So, uh, yeah. And I I mean, I feel incredible. I feel absolutely awesome when I started eating meat. So, what happened was so I did all the research. I did all this. I had clients and then um during COVID I was in the UK and you know I was like okay this is crazy all this stuff um and I'm working out and I'm like in the UK and I'm doing I'm like hit a really hardcore gym session and you know I was I was shooting a movie out there and did all this and then all of a sudden I felt really really tired and I said I'm starving. I don't know what's going on with my body and something God spoke to me and was just told me listen to your body. So I said okay body what do you want? I actually asked my body like what do you want do you need? And my body said fish. And I I'd been vegan for 25 years at this point right? So I said okay okay I'm just going to listen to my body. And so I grabbed a bit of um uh you know delicious salmon that was already cooked in the package. I ate it. Suddenly all the fuzziness in my head went away. Tiredness went away. I mean, it was like the, you know, and I would never been a person to watch those I used to be vegan things and I I was always like, "Oh, yeah, right. They're just not doing it right. That's why they're, you know," and I never had any issues. I mean, I was very lean, very fit, very um, in my opinion in in the epitome of health, right? I was very very healthy. But when I ate the fish, I noticed no, I was extremely tired and exhausted. This was health. Anxiety started clearing up. Um, I needed less caffeine cuz I was addicted to like six Red Bulls a day. But I would have told you I was healthy, right? Suddenly, I said, "Okay, I'm going to do this. I'm just going to eat fish. I'm not going to tell anybody. I'm I'm committing the ultimate sin, this poor little animal, and eating it." And so then I kept eating fish. And then I start adding eggs to my diet. And so I said, "Okay, I'm I'm a pescatarian now." Right? So fine, that's what I am. But see, I started dealing with this label. This is why I hate these labels that we find ourselves in because we get locked into it. Essentially, veganism, like any diet, any strict diet. Even carnivore can be. It can essentially become a eating disorder if you are obsessed with it. This is my viewpoint, right? M um I'm not finding that with carnivore though because now and seeing the new the new light now I've come into the light. I find it to be more a natural way for people to eat. I'm like, "Okay, so this is probably the anti- eating disorder because I can eat as much as I want. I don't count calories. I'm eating two, three steaks a day, fried in butter. It's delicious." You know, I mean, this is amazing. I love to eat. I I'm a Latina and Italian girl. I like to eat, right? So Mhm. making that transition over was rough mentally, but physically I felt fantastic. I could work out longer, stronger. And then when I came back to the States, I met my now husband and he was part carnivore. He was on like he was eating tons of just eggs and beef and then but doing sweet potatoes kind of like a paleo kind of mix. And I thought, man, he's eating all this meat and this crazy. And but he said, "Listen, I was vegan before. He lost weight. He he was telling me how good he felt eating this kind of, you know, almost carnivore diet." And I didn't believe him. I thought he was crazy. I said, "No, no, I'll stick to pescatarian secretly because I still have my vegan sponsorships. I didn't want to say I'm vegan. I'm not vegan." I just stopped talking about veganism, but I didn't, you know, I felt like a fraud. And then I lost my voice. M and for a singer and a speaker, you know, we our voices are are my voice is my tool. So I was talking like this for like a couple months. Yeah. And I had to record a voice over. I had to record a new song. I had a a show booked where I had to sing a few songs as well live. And I had said yes to it while I was talking like this. I said, "Oh my goodness." And I was really raspy and I I couldn't fix it. I bought all the elixirs and things. And I don't and I don't do westernized medicine. So I was doing like herbs and tinctures, right? And finally my husband Jeremy said, "Why don't you try meat?" And so that was a year ago and my first meat was lamb, crumbled lamb. I did not like the taste of it. I'm still not a big lamb fan, but he loves lamb. But mentally, I was like, and then physically I had a stomach ache, but then I was fine. And the next day I ate some more meat. Then I tried hamburger meat and I fell in love with beef and then a week later my throat thing disappeared. Hey, isn't that crazy? It's amazing. I felt like God was showing me that. I I still don't know what that was if it was an infection and you know and I rarely got sick when I was vegan. I I would have told you I was the healthiest person ever. But I started running faster. Like my body system got a reboot. I felt more energized. Um, I could go longer, stronger, harder in the gym, wake up earlier, get more things done. Uh, my skin was glowing more, adding all these fats, animal products. I thought I was lactose intolerant. Sounds like sounds like I'm not like because I can eat cheese. Yeah. All these things went away. And I wasn't even somebody cuz I used to think, oh, people go carnivore. That's only if you're like dying of cancer. You have all these illnesses, you know? Like, I don't need that. That's not for me. I'm good. I got this. Nope. until something happened to me. And I now I'm like, I shouldn't have ever waited. I should have just been eating this way the whole time, you know, a healthy diet. I gradually became more and more meat-based. And I said, I want to try the carnivore challenge. I started watching your videos. I started like getting into it. And so now it's been 30 days. And the first week, I lost a pound a day of fat. And I my muscle tone is incredible because I'm not trying to lose weight. I'm trying to, you know, lose m lose fat but gain muscle because I still like to bodybuild and and train and so um but still want to stay curvy and feminine. So, you know, it's amazing. The biggest thing is I can eat so much volume of food and feel so satisfied. My sleep is better. I don't have this kind of almost had hypoglycemia kind of. My mom had that. So, I would have my blood sugar would drop really low and I would get starving and start shaking and get anxiety and have to eat something. I don't have that anymore. I love it. I got This is my snack. I don't really snack a lot. I just eat big heavy meals, but I had some of these pork rinds. Nice. So, yeah, I love it. It's It's brand new for me from being vegan to carnivore. It's quite a difference. Yeah. Nice. I really like how you said that that carnivore seems like to be the the anti-eing disorder because you you don't limit yourself in eating disorder. typically you're you're not you're not eating or you're vomiting or you're you're basically stopping yourself from getting nutrition. Yeah. And um and whereas this is you're eating as much as as you want of just these certain things. And when you sort of think about it, you know, when I think about it this way, it's like food is species specific. And you know, it's it's you know, a lion doesn't have an eating disorder if it only wants to eat gazelle. You know, it's just like that's what its body is telling it. And that's the only thing I want to eat as well. And you know, it's not that I I like I wish I could eat all these other things and I'm just stopping myself and it's harming me. A, it's not harming me. B, I have no interest in eating those other things. I don't want to eat any of those things. Amazing. I know. That was the biggest shock for me is I didn't have a desire to eat. So, I do get a little bit bored. I did get some boredom. So, I've gotten really creative like making carnivore cakes and I'm into that recipes and the pancakes and all the uh you know and I I do I kind of do carnivore flex cuz I do a little bit of cacao powder, right, to make a chocolate thing. Um but for the most part, I've had a few cheats, but then I feel like crap after it. So, I go, "Yeah, I don't really need this." I could actually commit to carnivore for the rest of my life, I think. I'm not saying I'm going to do it, but it's so much more possible. And I I thought I thought you guys were crazy. I thought this was crazy. I was like, that's so restrictive. Yeah. But like you said, I didn't, you know, I think it's a texture thing, right? So I could have creamy, crunchy, finding a variety of things, but my favorite thing to eat, and I ate this for two weeks straight and didn't get tired of it, was a big old steak, New York strip steak fried in butter. Oh my gosh, it it just satisfied it. I had that feeling like you said it's like I don't crave anything else and two eggs and I would have two eggs all grass fed humanely raised antibiotic free non GMO blah blah blah I have to have it like that right and it just a little bit of pepper a little bit of salt didn't crave anything else I couldn't believe it hey guys just want to take a second to thank our sponsor Carnivore Bars because honestly all you need to be healthy is to just eat meat for those times that you're out hiking road tripping or stuck at work and you want nutritious snack that is just meat fat and salt if you want it. The carnivore bar is a great option. So, I like this product not because it's just pure meat, but also because I want the carnivore market to thrive as well. And the more we support meat only products, the more meatonly products there will be available in the mainstream. So, if this sounds like something you'd like to get behind, check it out using my discount code Anthony to get 10% off, which also applies to subscriptions, giving you 25% off total. All right, thanks guys. Your your body looks for nutrients. It doesn't it doesn't track calories, right? You're not just looking for bulk. It's like, well, as long as it as long as this thing is sack is full, we'll trust you. You know, it's like, no, your body's your body's way more sophisticated than that. And you have receptors in your stomach that track up your vag nerve to your brain and actually keep track of the amount of nutrients that are in your stomach right then and there. So, it doesn't have to have that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So this I mean this is why you get that feeling of satiety long before those nutrients are inside your body and your body has all the nutrients it needs. Your body knows what's coming down the pike. So your body can see that and just go like, "Oh, okay. We have some, but we want more." So things still taste good. That that meat is still desirable and it still tastes good. Tastes good. But you'll notice it tastes slightly less good as you go. And then eventually it doesn't taste good at all. And you have a bite that just sort of tastes like cardboard and like that's weird. It's not really interesting anymore. and you just stop. If you finish a steak and it's good to the last bite, you probably go make another steak because your body's telling you that it still wants more, you should probably have a bit of leftovers at least at the beginning until you sort of can understand what your body's telling you and how much it wants and you can sort of gauge how much you want. And um Wow. But that's how it does that. Yeah. And so long before your body absorbs it, your body's looking at the stomach going like, "Yep, that's enough. We're done." Now, if you're eating vegetables and fruit and grains and other sorts of of things that don't necessarily have the nutrient density of meat and you know anti-nutrients and toxins inside, but they just don't have those requisite nutrients. They just have bulk because there's a lot of fiber. It's stretching your stomach. You're getting physically full, but you're not your hunger is not actually satisfied because your your body can see it's like, yeah, there there's nothing in here. that there's stuff but there we actually need food, you know. That's crazy. It's so true because I would feel that and I mean I was raw vegan for a year. I was I I I tried everything and it wasn't to try to solve and now when I was younger I modeled a lot. So I was very thin, very lean, like very thin um fit but you know lean lean lean thin and I was trying to stay skinny for modeling because they would always be like you're too big. So, I would try to try different, you know, ways to try to eat to fill myself up, exactly what you said, but not overeat. And raw vegan, I felt a lot of energy on it. I felt great. Uh, it was very impractical, though. You know, you I'm bringing avocados on me, you know, to eat on the plane. I was just like, that's all I could eat and apples. And then it was very tough cuz I also craved cooked warm foods, right? Like comfort. And I never felt full. Like I did get more energy. I think it was better than eating the cooked vegetables for me, but it didn't and at the end of the day I'm like it it doesn't give me what I want. So when I switched my goals to bodybuilding and I said now I need to build muscle. I competed as a vegan and won true trophy trophies. Nice. But which thank you was amazing. Um but I ate so many grains. The diet I had I had a trainer for that. The diet I was on was so grainfilled. so many protein shakes and so it was not even though it it got the desired effect. I felt awful, right? Like I felt miserable. I looked fantastic. Now eating carnivore and lifting, I can lift for two hours and I like to lift heavy and I feel incredible. Like I I don't feel bad, you know? I feel I feel satiated. I also feel like very like yeah, I'm going to dig into the steak and like I I I earned it. I deserve it. And then after I feel like, oh yeah, I fed my body. My body feels happy. It's crazy. I don't feel snacky. I used to snack on a lot of chips and a lot of like things like that that I would have said is healthy. Um, and then the way I I counsel and consult with my clients is different, too, because I say, "Hey, listen. Why don't you add some more meat there?" You know, why don't you add butter? They'll be like, "Oh, I'm sorry. I was cooking with butter." You should cook with butter. Yes, tallow. Beef tallow. You know, I'm one of those converts now. And my clients are happier because It's just practical. It's easy. Yeah. Have the burger, take off the bun, you know. Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, even little things like that, you know, just moving in the right direction, you know, is is it makes a huge different for difference for people and their both their results and their health. And, you know, when you we see so many people when they're trying to lose weight, maybe you for model, you want to stay skinny, so I'm going to go vegan. I'll just have a high fiber food that fills up my stomach but doesn't actually give me any nutrition. That was the argument in the 80s and and early 90. You may remember this as a kid. I certainly do. That they said, you know, well, well, to satisfy your hunger, you know, go to eat a bunch of vegetables because it has all this fiber, but it doesn't have any calories. And so there's like the celery diet where you just you can eat, it takes more calories to process the the celery than it does than you get from the celery. And so it's just like you just eat as much celery as you want. You'll just be losing weight, losing weight. It was just like, who wants to live that life? It's a horrible life. Dieting is horrible. Yeah, it's not a lifestyle. It's awful. And I love fats. That's what, you know, I was very low on omega fatty acids and I used to, you know, uh I used to supplement those being a vegan. And I healed so many of this tiredness, this agitation, this hunger, this what it's it's even hard to to classify, but I know you know what I'm talking about. Something that's running this tape. It must be the body going like, "Feed me nutrients. feed me nutrients. That went away when I started eating high fats. First was salmon. I love salmon, but to be honest, my favorite food right now is just beef. Like, I just eat steaks and butter all day. I'm such a big bro, right? I feel like so good. Tastes amazing. And you know when especially especially when people are trying to stay slim or you know women they they go into like a vegan thing and and some people it becomes an eating disorder because they want to stay skinny and they're skinny and they're quite obsessed with it and so they they want to eat these things and and because they think if you eat meat or fat you're going to get fat you there's no chance at all that I'm going to do that but you you look back at at the you know the beauty icons you know of you know previous times and what do they eat. Well, Marilyn Monroe was very open. She ate bacon and eggs every morning. She ate a lot of meat. She was very clear. She ate a lot of meat. That was her main staple was fatty meat and eggs. Yeah. So, you know, and you know, she wasn't a, you know, you know, a Calvin Klein, you know, paperclip model. Thank God cuz nobody wants that anymore. It's I, you know, and that's not the way a feminine body should look. Some women are naturally thin. That's okay. But now my programs, I have my my women, I call them my curvy, confident queens. I have the ladies that want to build a booty. They want to have nice juicy glutes. They want to have soft feminine curves, but they want to have lower fat body fat, but some body fat, right? And muscle. And the men want to be ripped strong king. So I I train people so differently now than I did before. And I would have told you I had a healthy mindset. That's why it's so important to have push back and conversations and watch the opposite views, you know, because we can be in a bubble. I was the most stubborn. I would have told you, yeah, in my 20s I'm I'm the most healthy. I know exactly, you know, I know what I'm talking about, you know. But when you start to see, this is why I love the internet, too, that we have so many different opinions and ideas and podcasts like this. So, you have conversations. Someone might listen to this and be like, "Oh, yeah. I think a little bit like him. I think a little bit like her." and then form your own opinion. And that's the basis of everything. Form your own opinion. Do some experimentation. That's why I had to try carnivore. I was like, "Okay, I'm hating on these guys, but I'm already eating meat." So, like I've been wanting to do something I call like a carnivore cleanse cuz I'm like I was big into the cleanse. I did juicing and I love fasting and I love, you know, so I said, "Okay, what if I did a carnivore cleanse?" Because I loved bread. Sourdough bread was my Achilles heel. Can't keep it in the house. It would just be gone and my husband make fun of me. But now we keep bread here because he eats bread. I don't eat it. I don't touch it. I don't think about it. I'll have a carnivore cake. I make carnivore ice cream the other day. Um I'm always making some kind of carnivoreish muffins, you know, with cheese and I'll mix eggs. I use beef tallow for everything. Tons of sea salt. I noticed when I eat more salt, like I have sea salt in my water here and I eat more fats, it's easier to just eat meat because at first I thought this is going to be hard. It wasn't hard in the beginning um because I was doing lots of salts and fats and then probably the third week it got a little rougher and then um this week I've had cravings because I'm on my cycle. So, I'm like, "Okay, time to bring out that carnivore chocolate cake, carnivore ice cream." Like, make me feel like I'm eating naughty things, but it's healthy. I'm not even eating any fruit. And I I kind of when I started eating meat, I kind of stopped eating fruit. It's interesting cuz I don't see it. I know some carnivore people eat a little bit of berries, right? Is that Do you eat some fruit or you just just No, you're pure. 100%. Yeah, 100%. Never cheated. Never had a cheat day. Never wanted to. That's incredible. That's amazing. That is That's And you don't find a lack of variety in the carnivore diet? No. I mean, the thing is if you know, I've always just wanted to eat steak anyway for, you know, for my birthdays every year, you know, my mom would my mom's an amazing cook. I mean, she like just absolutely fantastic and she had she has over 500 cookbooks. She has read all of them. She has used all of them, you know. She absolutely just loves like the culinary, you know, um uh experience and and um just of of making the food and mixing these things together and even the chemistry and the chemical, you know, bonds and connections that they make. You know, a guy chef Alton Brown who goes into like the chemistry behind uh food and how these things mix together and these chemical bonds and reactions that make these flavors that you're looking for. And so my mom loves all that stuff. And so we'd have these like amazing dinners all the time. But for our birthday was just like whatever you want. She was going to make like the dinner you wanted. All I wanted every year was just like as much steak as I could eat. Not just like the portion for the table and you know there's seven people in the family so it's just like you didn't necessarily get all the meat that you wanted. And I always wanted a lot of meat. Yeah. But it was like it's my birthday. I want big ass steaks. I want to I want to keep eat be able to keep eating steak until I don't want to eat steak anymore. I just want as much, you know, just big steak a cow, you know, with like Yeah. with like some like Holland sauce or something like that like on or Bernay's sauce on it um at the time. And um and and so that's what I would do. And then when I started doing carnivore full on and and and in intentionally so knowing this is what I was doing. I wasn't just like, well, I'm not going to eat plants or whatever and just defaulting into carnivore. Um I it just felt so wonderful and it just felt so right. And every day I was just eating a big amazing steak until I felt like, you know, not eating anymore. And I said to my dad, I was like, "It just feels like my birthday every day." He goes, "I get I get exactly what I want every single day. I just have this big amazing steak. This is like my special birthday meal that I have to wait once a year for just to really treat myself. I get this every day. Every single day I get this amazing steak." And so, you know, there's there's there's nothing else that I want. Um, you know, awesome. Yeah. The the only times I'll I'll I'll sort of, you know, snack on like a bit of cheese or lunch meat or something like that is just like if there's not if I don't have steaks cut up and I'm like just too lazy to like do something. I'm like, I'll just I'll have this right now. I'll cut something up later. Something like that. Otherwise, it's just it's just stakes. And so, you know, with when I'm, you know, you know, with other people and things like that or or we're traveling or I'm at, you know, visiting family, you know, it's it's um, you know, there's always meat available. I can always cook it, but there might be other other things around. It doesn't tempt me. But when it's in when I'm in my house, my house is just meat. It's just stacks of meat. And so it's like my my fridge is like like a butcher's, you know, shop, you know. It's like it's, you know, so I've got I've got Do you eat fish as well? Yeah, sometimes. Yeah. Like, you know, um wild caught and um nice only. And um but 99% of what I eat is just beef. And um so yeah, so I have I have whole fridge and I've got big fryback packs of beef that are just sitting there wet aging and then I've got them cut up and you know salted if I you know back when I used salt now I don't use salt. You don't use salt? It just doesn't taste good to me anymore. Wow. At first, at first it's a good idea to use salt, though, especially if your body's craving it because when your insulin levels are coming down, when you go ketogenic, it's not carnivore, it's ketogenic. And when your insulin levels come down, you can lose too much uh salt out of your kidneys and um and so I noticed that I get really tired until I would put salt in water. Yeah. And you and so yeah, you lose the salt, you get salt um wasting in your urine and you also get dehydrated. So, and the dehydration can really make you tired as well. So, yeah, adding in more water and some more salt to replace that can be really helpful. And then eventually you get keto adapted and and your insulin levels just sort of normalize and then it's you're not losing as much. You don't need as much. There's some people I've I I know one person that years onto a ketogenic diet still needs to add just a buttload of salt. I mean like seven grams a day, like tons of salt and taking salt tablets and things because that that's what he needs. He he feels he doesn't feel good without that. Yeah. And whereas otherwise he feels fantastic otherwise. And um but you know everybody else it just that sort of levels off. And for me I would salt yeah I salted pretty heavily at first and uh and then that sort of went down and down and down and down and down until now like um bacon just tastes in intensely salty to me. Wow. And so yeah and that sort of sucks. Your body got it salt stores. It's fine now. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So, you do limited dairy? Limited? Very lied. Raw milk? Very rarely. Like once a year sort of thing. Yeah. Oh, wow. We drink raw milk in the house. It's It's really good for you, you know. It's like it's it has tons of nutrients and and a lot of things that are very beneficial. Um it has enough carbohydrates that it will spike your insulin. And I've checked that on myself, you know, drinking drank raw milk for, you know, three days in a row. And I checked my insulin. It absolutely came up. My fasting insulin came up. And so, you know, that had that did have an effect um on me anyway. And um so it it can be depending on how much you drink, it can spike your insulin enough to kick you out of ketosis. And I do think that ketosis is is a useful thing to be in. If you're having a glass of milk with your meal or something like that, it's probably not a big deal. The problem comes when you uh keep going back because it has quasomorphines which are or I don't know you want the addiction is not the right word, but it does cause like sort of compulsive eating and it tells the baby mammal, hey, keep eating, keep eating, keep eating, keep eating so that it grows because baby animals are are vulnerable. they get eaten. And so, you know, you're trying to protect these things. You know, we're not we're not like lizards or frogs that are having, you know, thousands of little babies, you know, per clutch. You know, we we've got, you know, one or two. And like these little suckers need to survive, you know, or else or else we're done. And so that they that those komorphines and I I believe the the carbs um as well will cause them to say, "I want more. I want more. I want more. I want more." And um and so that does that to us. and then we end up eating more than we want or sort of having compulsive sort of relationship with that raw milk. So like when I when I get my hands on raw milk, it doesn't last long and you know so I'm like like I'm like you with the sourdough bread like it just doesn't it doesn't sit around. I know. And so if I have like a regular supply of that I'm like just I'm just drinking a lot of that and I'm just like okay no I got you don't need that. Exactly. That's your addiction. Do you do any keto or I should say carnivore desserts? Um, it's more steak usually, you know. Steak. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I don't Yeah. I don't do use any sweeteners or anything like that because the sweeteners can um they can actually re-trigger the carb cravings and the sugar cravings and things like that. And so, even though they're not sugar, they can still trigger some of those centers in your brain saying like, "Oo, sweet. Remember that." Then then you want that sweetness. Is there any sweetener that doesn't do that? I know alulose is a big one trending now. Um I I think they'll all give a bit of that because it goes through your lyic system and your memory and things like that. You're just like that. Is it better to just do the honey or the maple syrup in that point? I think alulose would be better than that because because it, you know, I don't I don't know for sure that alulose doesn't do this, but I'm I I'm not aware of alulose giving like a um a dopamine hit to your reward centers of your brain like fructose does. So fructose is actually addictive. It's an actual addictive drug by the strictest medical definition. It it is a drug. And so like from honey or fruit or maple syrup, there's a lot of of fructose in there. It's actually in, you know, there's it difference and varies in in honey, but in uh you know, some honeys have more fructose than high fructose corn syrup, you know, so it's very high in fructose. It has other things that are beneficial in there, too, but you get the bad with the good, you know, so um you have to be aware of that. And and the fructose is is addictive. It gives it gives a a large dopamine hit to your addiction centers in your brain just like cocaine, heroin and meth. And they've done studies with MRIs with humans giving them like a you know some sort of empetamine like a you know an aderall or something like that to like you know someone who's not addicted to any of these things and and those addiction those reward centers light up like a Christmas tree right which is why you're like oh yes that was good. Then they give that same dose to a meth addict and it barely twinkles because all those areas have actually been so worn out with a meth addiction that they've actually died and there just there's barely anything left. But then they gave that same dose to a sugar addict who's metabolically sick and same barely twinkle as the meth addict. So this is as addictive as crazy. We should do that with social media addicts too. See what probably probably the same probably very similar dopamine hit. I started my days off with prayer and worship now and I I don't even look at my phone because I used to be so addicted to looking at my phone in the morning and I thought, well, I'm not looking at Instagram. I'm checking my emails. I'm being very organized. We were talking about that. Now I'm like, my assistant looks at my emails. My mornings are for me. I kiss my husband. I praise the Lord. I spend a good hour. I read my Bible. I do anything without screens. before then I jump on and do my live show because if I and then when I'm I'm already on cameras and in front of computers and electronics all day, I try to get out and touch grass because it's addicting all this like and it and it can cause this anxiety. The dopamine hits like sugar, the dopamine hits like social media. I don't we don't want to have any of that stuff. It's just all unnatural. So, I feel like I'm so grateful that people for you and for people like you and and me and people who are starting to become more aware of this. We're going back to nature. We're going back to the way our bodies were created to be, right? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And yeah, I I love that. I I hate my phone. I hate being having to be stuck to it all the time. And you know, it's just such a shame because I do so so much of my work through that. So much communication and messages. I really I think it's made it overly complicated and unnecessarily complicated. I mean, we have 50 different apps to do the exact same thing as as a text message, you know? I know. It's crazy. Like, why do why do we need that, you know? Like, just send send me a damn text. Like, I I don't want that. I don't want all these messages. It just it just drives me nuts. And I've got to go from one app to the other app to the other app to the other app and check. Oh, maybe I have to go back to the other app. Maybe I've missed something there. Oh, maybe there's another message and I have to go back. I know. I think they did it on purpose just to make you so you're just doing this ring around the rosie thing just looking at all your different apps and then you just you can never get off of it because I have to check an app. I have to check an app. I have to check an app. It's a ding ding ding ding. People who don't have their notifications silenced drive me crazy. People complain all the time. I try to call you. Listen, my phone's always on silent. I don't care. I can feel it when it rings. If if I meant to pick it up and see that it's you, I will pick it up when it's ringing or I will look at it on my own time. My phone is like a home phone. I don't want to be that reachable. I don't want you to be able to unless you're like my in intimate innermost family, right? You shouldn't be able to get a hold of me that quick. So, I'm very like I I rarely do I jump on a phone call. There's like very few people like four people in my life that I'll jump on the phone and be that reachable because it just causes anxiety. And when I'm at the gym, I'm putting music on. Um, but I'm not on my phone, right? I'm not I'm I'm I have to discipline. Okay, music, but like look at things outside of yourself cuz we start looking our eyes are just like here and here and it causes exhaustion when you can't look out. Have you ever looked at a screen for hours and then you look out a window and and the window's fuzzy? I've had that happen where I go, "Okay, I have to adjust my eyes. I have to be able to regularly be doing that." So, I think we're just going back to regular roots, like our regular roots is very simple stuff. Go outside, eat meat, right? We don't have to get weird. That's what I I teach my clients. You don't have to It doesn't have to be complicated. It doesn't have to be weird. Let's just, you know, take a walk and eat some healthy food and just get in the gym and do this and do that. So, yeah. Absolutely. I I was going to say, too, you mentioned the um you know, your your clients wanted to get like curvy and things like that. might be too late, you know, when people are adult, but you that's one of the things that people don't realize is that, you know, we have these little stick figure people walking around, you know, like the Calvin Klein model or, you know, very very Yeah. And um part of that is is because of lack of nutrition during adolescence and and development. If you don't get these essential fats, soluble nutrients that only exist in animal foods, um you're you're not going to develop properly. K2, D3, um those are very important for facial and bone structure. So, you're not going to get, you know, as wide a jaw, you're going to get uh crooked teeth, crowded teeth, although teeth are exactly the same, but they're they're expecting to come into a bigger jaw. And they should come in just be straight and nice and get all your your wisdom teeth and everything like that. You're designed for that. It's just if you don't get enough vitamin D3 or K2, it won't develop properly or calcium as well. And um so you need all of those things. And um one of the things about um being curvy um is vitamin D. And uh you know, we've been vilifying the sun. Another natural thing that that we've grown up in and we're not trogodites. We didn't we didn't we're not underground dwellers that just found this strange new world, you know, up above the the cover your eyes, stay away from the sun. Uh yeah, we're not like these chuds that are just like, you know, underground and just like, you know, you know, just need to avoid the sun and um you know, so we're actually designed to be out there. You know, our bodies are meant to be out in the sun. Our eyes actually developed before Edison made the light bulb. Crazy as it sounds, but the our eyes were actually designed to take in light from the sun, as strange as that is. And people just forget that. They think it's, "Oh, it destroys your eyes. It's going to destroy your body. It's going to destroy your skin." We're getting the least amount of sun exposure in recorded history. The highest skin cancer and the highest skin cancer as well. Wow. And we're depressed, right? Which low levels of vitamin D lead to depression. So now we're on pharmaceutical. Yeah. Yeah. Our immune systems are compromised. We're pale. We're ugly. We're skinny. It's like, tells how you really feel. We're ugly, skinny, stupid, useless. We're dumb. We're useless human beings. But it's so it's so true. We're like, and it's a weird concept, but humans were actually designed to live on planet Earth with the sun with the way it is. Crazy concept. Crazy concept that God already gave us the skin and the eyes and the bones and the marrow to be able to survive on this planet. We don't actually have to have this trillion dollar industry of skin creams and all this anti-aging and surgery. I mean, I'm a big person of take care of your skin. But yeah, I started going out in the sun more too, you know, getting out of the cult of veganism. My skin used to burn from the sun. And I've heard some influencers who talked about it because I like to consume other people's content too and like what are they saying? What's their experience? Right? And some people said once they started eating meat, some exvegans, their skin was able to stay in the sun without getting burnt. And now I have I'm a woman of color, so I I don't get burned, but I used to get this weird tingling like I don't know, it would be like it would it would hurt after a while. So I would avoid the sun. And now I'll walk to the store without sunblock, which you would have never seen Joy do 10 years ago. And it doesn't hurt. It doesn't bother me. I mean, I I if I really want to shield my face so it doesn't get wrinkly, I just put like a hat on, right? Or beef tallow, right? Doesn't beef tallow have some SPF is great. Uh it's about SPF 4. Emu oil is about SPF8. Um but but it's also just good for your skin. And it helps hydrate and moisturize your skin which helps it be healthier and protect and and that is protection in and of itself. And um the other thing is is vitamin D um is your own natural uh sunblock. You know, you want UV light on your skin by the way. I mean it's actually it we have more photo receptors on our skin than we do on our eyes. And so we get signals and and communication, you know, and uh and and um you know, our body knows which hormones to pump out and things like that. We should be naked in the sun. We should go back to naked probably. Yeah. Well, you Well, then there's that whole other thing. There's a whole bunch of people out there sunning their taints and things like that. You know, it's just god awful. Like I don't care how how good of like an improvement you get with that. Like you can keep that one for yourself. That's your own that's your own secret. about it. Oh god. Vaginal sunning experience. No. And um yeah. So, but vitamin D, you know, we make it on the surface of our skin. It's actually um it's actually our own natural UV protectant. And when you're not eating um meat, you're not getting proper um vitamin D because a you're not getting vitamin you're not going to get vitamin D from your food, but you're also not going to get uh cholesterol. you're going to make some cholesterol, but the problem is when you're eating very plant-based that the plants have their own cholesterol. They're called plant steriles or phytosteriles, right? And that is similar enough in chemical composition to our own cholesterol that when we absorb it into through our gut, it signals our liver that there's cholesterol coming in, so we don't need to make as much. And so that's why this has been recommended by doctors for decades to eat, you know, almonds and different sorts of things like that because they have those plant steriles will lower your cholesterol and cholesterol is bad because, you know, your body is trying to kill you and so you have to like protect it from it from itself. We weren't meant to live on this planet with cholesterol and our liver is supposed to cholesterol on a space blur somewhere without light and without gravity. That's how our body is. Yeah. And so, you know, um, that lowers cholesterol because it it stops our body from making cholesterol because, hey, we have enough. Now, you don't have enough. And vitamin D is synthesized from cholesterol. All of your sex, steroid hormones are synthesized from cholesterol. Mineralicorticoids, gluccocorticoids, estrogens, testosterone, progesterone, um, all these things, all it's all. So, now we have pale, skinny, ugly troglodites that can't stay in the sun. And they are also, what are those people that can't have sex? Incelss. Incelss. Yeah. Yeah. If you are vegan, this is you. This we're calling out vegan. Yeah. Impet and infertile. That's another thing too, you know. Testosterone down. Lowest fertility rates in recorded history. Lowest testosterone rates in human history. In recorded history, you have low worse sperm counts. Um, you know, that's getting worse and worse. It's not great. You know, it's like it's hard to find masculine men out there and feminine women because people's hormones are messed up. Yeah, it absolutely is. And you know and um you know and again stick figure that comes from a lot of that's from vitamin D and um well largely vitamin D at least for that. So vitamin D gives the secondary sexual characteristics of both men and women during puberty. So it it broadens men's shoulders, narrows the waist. you get that classic V-shaped appearance of like the old school bodybuilders back before they just became mass monsters and things like that and just up with steroids. But um but the actual classical, you know, male physique and in women it narrows the waist and widens the hips. You get that hourglass figure. Yeah. And um which is probably why there's like so many bikini models coming out of Brazil because they eat a lot of meat and they're in the sun, you know, so probably getting good vitamin D. Exactly. And they're hobbies out there. That's the hobbies are going to Yeah. Who knew? Just get sunshine and eat meat. It's the opposite of what they tell us. Exactly. Well, generally, I mean, that's a good rule of thumb is just whatever the authorities are telling you to do, probably not a good idea as far as like that's health advice, you know, authorities and celebrities and anybody who's famous and rich, they're getting a check cut to say that to say that sort of thing. Yeah, exactly. And um yeah, it's and at the end of the day, I mean, you like you said, try it, experiment, look at it yourself and just see, you know, I mean, the only thing that matters is the results that you get. as an individual, you know, even even if it's like you get better results as a vegan than a carnivore, like I don't care. Like, I'm happy for you, you know? I mean, you're not it's not it's not going to happen, but, you know, but if that were to happen, like I don't care. Like, I'm not invested in this or like I don't I don't care. I just want people to be healthy. And and you're not religious about it, which is great. I don't find I you know, I was afraid initially when I went to try carnivore that it would be like the vegan world I came from. very cultic, very like religious about it. Like, oh, you ate, you cheated, you don't count. But people, like literally I the carnivores I talked to, they don't care. They're like, cool. It works for you, works for you. If it doesn't, it doesn't. It's very healthy. See, because they have vitamin D in their brain. So, it's like people who are just chill, they're casual, healthy. Yeah. Do you think it's been done? Well, I know the answer for myself, but do you think this has been done on purpose to hide the carnivore se? Like is it a secret that people are there? They they forced us to do you think it's done on purpose or do you think it's just it's there's nothing nefarious about it? There's a lot of intention behind this. Yeah. I mean you have you have people being paid to explicitly attack the carnivore diet and being attack meat and all these other sorts of things and you're seeing it now. I mean it's it's a very coordinated effort and if there's the coordination then there's coordination. There's there's a plan. There's someone there there's people saying hey let's all do this at the same time. you know, there was a there was a um I forget the name of her channel, but she had some, you know, um fitnessy health sort of thing and channel like blew up just in a year. So, it looked like is like this could have been like a sort of a manufactured account. She had um you know every single post was just like perfectly structured and scripted and lighted and edited and uh it's one year old exactly like this month and she's got 1.5 million followers and everything is just it was very plant-based you know very you know very mundane calories in calories out you know don't eat junk food and all that sort of stuff but but you know have some but don't you know go crazy but you know don't don't stay away from it because oh you should have some or else you're going to binge All the all the classic tropes, you know, classic tropes. Yeah. And Yeah. And like and and nothing about meat, you know, all all the protein thing. Oh, this high protein, you know, almond butter, you know, bar sort of thing. It was all plant-based sort of proteins and things. And then all of a sudden there was a post like a couple weeks ago where it was just like, I tried the carnivore diet because I wanted abs. And I got abs. It was so great. But then the health issue started. I lost my period and I got PCOS and and there like shows her in the hospital with like a you know a drip in her arm and things like that plant acne and all that sort of stuff. Yeah. And so and I was just like yeah you you don't actually get hospitalized with PCOS and you don't need IV medication for PCOS either. Sorry that's not what that is. And it's like oh I don't have my period. I need to go on a drip and check and um dripping blood like And yeah, it's like we're just going to pump estrogen into your into your veins and like um but then it was um but then she was saying so I did corn for eight weeks and it just destroyed my health, right? And now it's been 12 weeks on since she did that. So at the time of the video she said it was 12 weeks on, right? This this was two weeks ago. Oh, it could have been before. It could have been No, she said she was still doing this going through it and it has been 12 weeks. She just posted it. She's saying she's talking about now. Okay. So, that's 12 weeks that she's been recovering and she says she's still not recovered. And then eight weeks on that that this did. So, that's five months. Her account's only existed for a year. You go back through the last five months of her stuff, it's all plant-based. Plant-based. There's no acne anywhere. She's not talking about PCOS now going to the hospital, anything like that. There's nothing. There's nothing. And there's not a word of it. It's the only thing that's ever mentioned that. And then the literally the next day or the day after like within very close proximity of this other big accounts, you know, with hundreds of thousands or over a million followers that all push this whole processed food is is okay. You know, like having some sugar and this and that. It's not that big a deal. and you know, you're just being, you know, fairers and, you know, putting out, you know, studies on seed oils and and aspartame and all these other sorts of things saying it's not they're not bad and all that sort of stuff. And some of them who've been paid to say this because they got busted by the FTC and um and got a written warning. It's public record right now and threatened with a $50,000 fine if they don't straighten up. Now, people like that are now have a fully edited and scripted and published video, you know, responding to her video that just came out the day before and saying, "Oh, well, this you see this this this shows that carnivore is a really bad idea. This is an influencer come out. She's she's broken her side. She's talking about this and talking about her experience, this that and the other." And it's just like multiple people are doing that and they all publish on the same day. So that's a coordinated effort. Absolutely. You know, and that's that's a complete and utter con. And I see fake accounts popping up saying, "Oh, hey, I'm carnivore, but oh, now I'm going to stop carnivore because of my cholesterol." It's like a fake account. You've got six posts, you know, like what the hell are you talking about? I'm like, you know, and um so crazy. They call that um they call it astrourfane. Have you heard that term? Yeah. So, you know, grassroots is a natural movement that comes from the roots. You know, it's like grassroots. It's like people um carnivore is very grassroots. It's shared naturally. There's no like overhead carnivore, you know, I don't know, like leader and that we have to follow and eat the certain thing. So astroturfing which is fake grass is when a company and the pharmaceutical companies are known for doing this. They did this with Aderall and all those studies for kids is they would hire fake people or they hire real people to create fake personas online and they would infiltrate all the mommy blogs and they say, "Oh, my kid had the same problem like you, Susan, and this is why I used aderall, you know." And then so now moms are reading these blogs going, "Well, this helped for this mom who looks like me and wow, she reads this blog and she's on this Facebook group and before you know it, there's a movement started." But it was started by, you know, and literally if you think about these companies that have billions of dollars to put into this to attack small creators like you were just like literally like, "Hey, I'm a doctor that just happens to eat this way. It helped healed me and my patients. I want to tell people about it." And then you don't have all this, you know, brand money recognition Coca-Cola budget to to do what they do. So this is what they do. this is their tactics and it's astrourfing and so many companies but it's been exposed because like you you're smart you can see it people can just do a Google search and be like what you know let me ask chat GBT real quick oh yeah this is fake but they're dumb they're all like old you know people in their 60s that just are like I'll give you $100,000 make those accounts make it make it look good they can't they can't stop the small creators like us and we're some of the bigger creators on the internet compared to normal people, but we're small compared to what we come up against. You know, the the major pharmaceutical companies, the major um you know, big food, right? We have big pharma, big food. It's crazy. Yeah. Well, and that's the thing. I mean, they've been doing this sort of thing for decades. And so, you know, they've been vilifying meat, vilifying fat to to push their own products, their sugary processed food, plant-based. Meanwhile, they're eating the best steaks and fats. I'm sure. Always. Right. Always. They were definitely serving steak at Davos. That's for sure. You know, always saying that, you know, let let them eat bugs and like, but we're eating steaks, you know. Exactly. The bug thing is crazy cuz there's vegans who embrace that and they This is the weird thing when I noticed in veganism is they were embracing the the fake meat. Okay. I used to eat a lot of that fake meat. By the grace of God, I didn't die. It's so disgusting. But then when they started doing the lab grown meat, I never tried that. I mean, Bill Gates owns a lot of these fake meat companies, and I used to eat the vegan section. I just walk by and I give it the middle finger now. I used to eat all that crap. Fake cheese, fake meat, fake I mean, and then I started going, "This makes me sick. I I don't really like eating this." And then I luckily I like to cook, so I would create my own things, but still, you're creating out of vegetables and and and you're thinking it's healthy. It's not. It's a It's just this catch 22. you know, if I eat more vegetables, I'll be healthy healthy. But to eat healthy, you actually have to not eat a lot of vegetables, right? But nobody tells you that. They just tell you eat vegetables. So, all of it I I believe all of it's created. All of it's astroturf like you explained. All of it. And they just but they can't keep up with the real voices with real people, you know, real subscribers, real uh individuals who think for themselves. They just can't compete with authenticity because you can't fake a conversation like this, you know? Uh no matter how bad things get, I think real people are going to see the truth and they're going to be able to discern fact from fiction. They're going to look for it. That's what happened with me. I started going, "Okay, fine." You know, grassroots, my husband telling me about conser, you know, uh telling me about carnivore. And then I doing the research and then finding all these people online like you who created content and then being like, "Okay, let me try this." You know, and then feeling great, feeling freaking fantastic. Boom. Why would I go back? They they don't have you once you try it. That's why they always try to stop you from trying it. That's why the scare tactics cuz if they said you know what ve if if vegans were honest and they said you know what veganism is the best but try carnivore and if you don't feel better because you won't because vegan's the best come back to veganism. No because then it would lose all their people. That's what cults do is just don't read about it. Don't look at it. Don't research it. Just believe me. I'm telling you it's the best. So just Oh, okay. Hey everyone, really happy to announce a new sponsor for the show and for everybody down in Australia. It's Stockman Steaks, who are delivering highquality grass-fed and finished, pasture-raised beef and other meats, flash frozen, and vacuum sealed to your door. Something I've been enjoying a lot of myself recently as well. They also have a great range of specialty items such as high-fat keto mints and carnivore beef and organs mints with liver, kidneys, and beef heart as well. So, use code chaffy today for a free order of beef mints or another specialty gift along with your order at stockmanstakess.com.au and I'll see you over there. Thanks, guys. Well, I I tell people all the time it's probably a good thing that you you go back and and eat some of that stuff again. Eat some salad, eat some something like that cuz you you'll see exactly what this is doing to you if you do that. And so, you know, sometimes Yeah, exactly. you just feel rotten and you'll see what that's doing to you and you'll see why you're avoiding this. Okay, so you have the theory, you know, this theory, the concept these these plants have toxins, these things that don't agree with our body and we we've actually known for hundreds of years, thousands of years that there's certain plants you have to avoid. And in the last 150 years, there's people like Dr. Salsbury who are saying, "Hey, look, all these chronic diseases, these are actually coming from plant toxins that that are doing horrible things inside of our body and our gut." And so, you know, he made the same argument that I'm making now in the 1800s. And he was getting massive results and reversing um you know, rheumatoid arthritis, Crohn's, all these other sorts of gout um and and people were healing from tuberculosis because their immune system was getting better, you know, by by changing this. And so, you know, you're seeing all this and um they say, "Okay, well, look, you know, try it. See how you go for 30 days. go back to how you were eating or or try a vegan diet or just add a salad or an apple. See what it does. You know, you'll see because it's awful. I mean, the reason that I I know cuz I cheated and I was like, I don't want to do this anymore. That's it. That's it. And so I so many people will come and they'll say like, "Yeah, well I have um you know I have um you know people will say like you know like um you know they want to they want to try something else or you know maybe oh well can I have avocados like try it you know just get it out of your system for a month and and put it back in and see what it is and they always come back to me like yeah that's not going to work for me. I felt way way better when I was off that. or patients of mine that you know I say like because they have you know autoimmune issues, they've got diabetes, they've got these sorts of things like listen you know full elimination diet is gonna is going to do the best thing for you and just going to meat and water is going to be the best thing for you. You know they agree to it but they're sort of like oh I don't know and uh they do it for a few weeks and they're like okay yeah actually I'm feeling a lot better. Your numbers are getting better. Everything's getting better. And they're like oh but is there is there anything I can do just to sort of change it up because I'm really finding it hard to stick to this. And it's like, sure, okay, but you know, you have diabetes. I think it's really important to stick to, you know, a ketogenic approach, you know, to get your blood sugar down, get your insulin down, and then reverse this. And um they're like, okay, you can do that, but can have some some fruits and vegetables. Like, yeah, you want to avoid you still want to avoid these things. You want to stay away from night shades. You still want to be ketogenic and and you want to mix these things up. So, you don't want to have too much, you know, but you also uh don't eat the same vegetable every day because those toxins will build up. Oh, and this happened twice that people mo most people actually once they get on to it, they're like, "This has changed my life. I'm not definitely not going back." And uh and like you say, you once you try it, you know, it's it the game's over because you can't you can't fake results. And so, you know, and not in your own body and maybe you can make it up online and lie and say you were in the hospital for PCOS, even though you don't have to go to the hospital for PCOS and go on a drip, but people believe that. But you know what? You can't fake your own results in your own body. You can tell yourself all you want that you're healthy on a vegan diet, but then you start eating meat, you're like, I didn't even realize how bad I felt until I just went away from it. Exactly. It's crazy. You don't know what you don't know. That's it. You have to experiment. You have to try it. Yeah, definitely. And and people are and so like I have two patients that were like, we have to sort maybe can we open it up a bit? Like sure. First, we came up with a plan and um came back a month later like, "Okay, how you doing?" And they're like, "I think I have to go back to full carnivore." And I was just like, "Oh, really?" I mean, it's like I was just being so much better on that. I I had no idea. I had no idea until it just went. And then the glasses came in, you know? You seen those memes on you? You had the Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Snoop Dog comes in. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Told you. They're like, "Yeah, what do I know? I'm only a doctor." Exactly. You're only a doctor who's been doing it for how many years have you been carnivore now? Um, well, currently just seven years, the last seven years straight. And then five years in my early 20s when I was just Wow. You know, just no plants. That was the main thing. And then sort of slipped back onto a very clean, omnivorous, meat heavy diet. Yeah. But I would I would basically eat a bunch of meat and I'd have a salad because you're supposed to eat a stupid salad, you know? Nobody likes salads, too. No. No. They're hard to eat. It's hard to take down. Even as a vegan, when I was raw vegan, I was like, it's a it's a lot to chew. It's not like it's enjoyable. You know, you don't you don't naturally feel like this is something I should eat, which should show us something. Everybody wants to eat a burger and a steak. So, so what do you recommend to people? Do you recommend that they ease into carnivore or just go straight in? It depends on the personality, you know. Um, and um, but I I I know there's good arguments in either direction. I've seen a lot of really good results with people just jumping in, especially when they're highly motivated and they're like, "This this seems right. This is what I want to do." Um, it's just jump in. Jump in head first. If you're sort of like, I don't know, and I'm this, sure, and you want to you want to ease into it and that's going to be easier for you, that's fine, too. Um, I eventually you're going to have to stop. So eventually there's going to have to be a cold turkey moment that you just cut this stuff out. And you know, people say like, well, you know, should I go in one time or this? It's like there's no bad time to stop eating poison. So, you know, just cutting it out is is fine. Um, but if you want to just sort of start ramping up the meat that you're eating and um, ramping up the meat that you're eating and start, you know, replacing out the other things and um, sorry and um, you want to start turning, you know, dialing it down on these other things, cleaning it up, eating more meat, you know, you're already going to start improving. But you know if you want to if you want to um you know do it in a transition sort of a slow transition you know you have a you have to start that transition today. So you got to cut something out. So you cut out you know processed food that's gone right and then you know on a calendar you mark it down one week from now you're cutting out carbs and grains and sugar everything. all that, all carbs, you're going ketogenic. And then the next week you're cutting out night shades, potatoes, tomatoes, eggplants, peppers, right? Capsicums. Next week, you're cutting out all beans, seeds, legumes, nuts, all that sort of stuff. And you just cut these things out as you go. And you're eating more and more meat as you go. And then on on this date, you know, four weeks down the road, I wouldn't really let it take longer than that, there's your ex. And it's just like it's only meat and eggs after this. So, you have to have a timeline. You have to have a clear progression. This is what I'm going to be cutting out this whole way. Not just I'll sort of eat a bit less and I'll sort of move my way into it. It's not gonna happen. No, you won't. You gota be like that's like the people that say I'm going to cut down on smoking. I'm going to wean myself off and then quit. Those are the guys who say that they're quitting smoking for 20 years straight, you know, and they never they never do until one day they're like, "Nope, I'm done. I can't do this anymore." And they and then they go cold turkey and then that's the way. Nice. Uh I have one question and I do have to get going. This has been so amazing. No worries. Um, can you drink alcohol on the carnivore diet? I mean, you can. You can do whatever you want, but it's it's a plant and it is a poison, you know. So, you know, it's literally a plant poison. Yeah. Exactly. Anti carnivore, huh? Yeah. So, you don't drink alcohol? Not in years, you know. Wow. That's amazing. And um and I I actually enjoyed drinking. You know, I was a rugby player and you know, we drank after games and that was that was a big part of the culture was, you know, the booze up afterwards. And u that was that was a lot of fun for me. But you know, I I actually stopped drinking during the rugby season when I was about the same time I went carnivore the first time inadvertently. And that's why I didn't figure out that like I had these massive health improvements from going carnivore at the time because I stopped drinking at the exact same time. ah 20. So I I was just like I was just like, "Oh my god, this is amazing." I was just like, "Okay, well I had like a month off from booze and I was like I've just I've never felt better in my life. I've never played better in my life." So I'm going to do this for the rest of the season not drinking and just had the best season of my life. It was just amazing. And then I was like, "Okay, I'm going to do this for the entire year now." Again, had the next year was my entire was best year of my life for rugby. And I was like, "Yeah, I just don't drink during the rugby season now. It's just not I have no interest." So, it's easier for me now. And so, I, you know, it's, you know, I've sort of had that where I wasn't like a big drinker anyway. But, um, when I when I do drink, it'd be like clear liquors, like vodka with like, um, soda water, like no mixers. So, it's just like clear clear booze with soda water or something like that. And, uh, and and that would be it. And um uh and even then the reason I don't drink all that often is because I feel that it it not I don't get hung over the next day. I'm just a bit you know tired. But then that that sort of tiredness is sort of persists. I'm sure you've noticed that you you're in like such a such a great time now because you're about 30 days into you got most of this crap out of your system. Your body's going to start working better and better and better and better as you go and your and your energy and and um fitness and everything is just going to start ramping up from here. your mitochondria are going to start doubling and then tripling, then quadrupling, and you're going to get more and more keto adapted. You're going to get more and more energy, and you be able to utilize all these ketones that your bodies are that your body's making now. And you're just going to get better and better as you go. And you're going to you're going to feel fantastic every week you go from here. And so, um, yeah, it's it's pretty exciting. And um you know when you get that and you'll notice in your workouts you can you can work out for 2 hours you can work out for 10 hours straight not stopping just balls out and you wouldn't be sore the next day and you feel great doing it because we make energy um in ketosis we make energy because of what we're doing. Like normally you need to eat a bunch of carbs and a bunch of sugar take a you know pre-workout and caffeine so you can get energy so you can then go use it in the gym. It's the opposite for us. Just sitting here talking to each other, we are making the exact amount of energy that we need to sit here and talk to each other. But when we start working out, we start exercising, we need more energy. So, we produce more energy and we burn more energy. And that's what makes us feel good. That's why pre-workout makes goes, "Yes, I feel good, but I have all this energy because you're burning more energy." That's that that's not having energy in reserves. That's just being fat. Burning the energy is what feels good. And that's why you feel good when you're on this on a stimulant. When we work out, we're burning more energy because we're producing more energy because we need more energy and we feel better, which makes you want to work harder, which makes you burn more energy and makes you feel better, makes you want to work harder. So, you have this positive feedback loop. Wow. Just hard work and just busting your ass in the gym. And that's why when I go to the gym, usually like I don't want to stop. Like I just want to keep working out and keep lifting. So, I'm doing like 20 sets of bench, 20 sets of squats, 20 sets of deadlift, 20 sets of shoulders. 20 sets. 20 sets. And I cap it at 20 because and I don't do that all the time now because I just don't have time. But when I did have time, I would cap it at 20 because it was just like 20 is already ridiculous. But it was just like going over that. But I I could keep going. I did 32 sets of heavy squats to failure. And I was just like I could just keep going. But I've been here for 4 hours just doing squats. And it's just like that's insane. And the gym like the the rotation of the people who work at the gym has changed three times already, right? Yeah. It's like uh how many sets do you have left, bro? I was like uh 27, you know, like and I was like, "What?" um thankfully was I had a home I had a home gym, so I wasn't I wasn't um You can't work out like that. Guys still doing squats. He was here this morning. It's now it's now dinner time. Yeah. Yeah. Like, dude, I was here yesterday. Are these the same squats? They're the same outfit. Yeah, exactly. Squats. Yeah. And um and so yeah, I capped it at 20. But that's the thing. You just feel so good. You just feel so amazed. You don't want to stop. And it's not that like I go to the gym so that I can feel better after I leave the gym. That's what a lot of people say, you know, it's just like, oh, the best part is when you get out of the gym, you're like, I feel so good having had worked out. But the workout was so hard. The workout is what I go for. I feel great during the workout. Yes. And um and and so I just love it. I just want to keep I just want to keep going unless I drink. And so I'll drink. I won't even get slammed and I won't even be hung over the next day, but I'll be more tired. And then I go to the gym and I'm like, "All right, yeah, go to the gym." And I do six sets of bench and I feel like trash. Oh my goodness. And I'm struggling. Normally I do 20 and I'm like, "Oh, maybe I'll just do 21. No, no, I got to go. It's 20. I got to go." Now I get to six, I'm struggling. I get out six, I'm like, "Okay, screw this. I'm done. I'm out. I got to go home. I'm just I'm just wrecked." And so it's like six sets that week. Now, most people are only doing three sets to failure. They may not even go to failure, you know, not even going to the gym. So, they might not see that. They might not see what's going on, but I see they might they might be skinny in their cave, not even getting sunshine. That's exactly, you know, and and um you know, and then the next week maybe I can do 10 or 12 sets, but I feel rotten, you know, at the end of that. I I stop at 12 because I don't feel good. Yeah. And then and then two, you know, 3 weeks on, maybe I'm I'm getting to, you know, 16 18 sets. Fourth week, I can do 20 sets again, but I'm not loving it. It takes you four weeks to recover from. So, it's not worth it. It's so not worth it. I noticed I don't drink all that much either, and I spent 10 years not drinking. I'm I'm one of those people. I can leave it or take it. Take it or leave it. But I noticed now when I drink, if I can only during carnivore, I can only handle one drink and I'm not I don't have a huge tolerance. It was I had two glasses of wine and ate meatballs with cheese and at a comedy event. My husband was performing and I was there for like two hours. Over the two hours stretched out sipping on two glasses of red wine. I was obliterated by the end of the night. I I was home like feeling sick. I'm like, "Oh, I feel like I I I binged two glasses of wine and I ate." It's crazy. So, but there is some sort of study that shows carbohydrates and alcohol, right? You can drink more on carbohydrates. Is that is that true? Is that accurate cuz I found I had to start researching it. Yeah. Yeah. I had I hadn't seen that, but yeah. Well, I I certainly know like I have like just a stupid high tolerance. Like even when I wouldn't drink for like a year or two, it would still take me like 15 20 drinks to like get going. That's expensive. It's so stupid. And I'm bringing all that poison in my body. 15 to 20 drinks. Yeah. It's insane. It's insane. Having not drank for 2 years. That's [ __ ] And I I would get pissed. It's a waste of money. Well, also you you're getting drinks at the bar. I like I couldn't get them fast enough to build up enough in my body to get a buzz or a drum. That's crazy. And so it was just it was just I felt I hated it. And so I was actually a lot happier when I stopped drinking and I was just like I don't have to worry about that crap anymore. But like you know every now you know sometimes like when I was um when I was drinking like I'd drink half a fifth of vodka um with Sprite in like a big gulp cup. And uh and I drink that in like 20 30 minutes. People thought you were alcoholic. And that would that was the that would just start to get me buzzed, you know, and like I had to start with that so that I could go to the bar and get drinks at like a rapid and still have 15 20 drinks. That's not fun. That's not fun. No, it's it's just so whiskey in my house lasts for months because I just I'll do like a little shot with some seltzer and and then I'm like oo I'm starting to get but carnivore I can't drink more than that. I can't even I can't have two drinks. like I have to stop because I'll get that sicky that that usually would happen for me like four or five drinks, right? I'd be like, "Okay, well, but two like that's crazy." So, I mean, if you want your alcohol to last longer, you want to be a cheap date, just carnivore. Yeah. Yeah. Or don't do any alcohol. That's perfect. I don't even think people need alcohol, but No, definitely not. I mean, I definitely noticed that as well. So, instead of like 15 20 drinks, it's only like eight or nine drinks, you It's much better. And at least there's that. At least it's something. And um and uh yeah, I remember um I was I was hanging out with a buddy of mine and we having some like whisies and it just like just whiskey neat and um and like I had my bottle he was drinking whatever he was drinking and we're just sort of hanging out and just talking. I wasn't really noticing how much I was having. And I got to a point where I just had like a nice warm comfortable buzz. And it was like I was not drunk. I was just buzzing. Just just a happy sort of chill buzz, relaxed. And I was just like I was like, "All right, that's that's a nice pleasant level." Like I like that that's a good level for me. You know, how much was that? How much did that take? This was a new bottle, by the way. And this was like a It wasn't even a fifth. It was like a full liter. There was that much left in the freaking bottle. You know, I ate I drank like 80% of this thing and I'm like that's [ __ ] I mean, it was like an like an $80 bottle of whiskey. It was like Woodford Reserve and um and it was like just ridiculous. I'm like it's not worth it. Yeah. I was just like, "Look, I'm not paying I'm not spending 80 bucks per alcohol resistant or something. There must be my liver just burns through it, you know." Yeah. It could be that's operating so well. It's filtering it. That is good. No one can give you alcohol poisoning. You can never Yeah. Well, unless you really try. But I mean, there's like like some points like where I was like like at like a friend's wedding and I was there for a few days and and it was like every night like I was no matter how much I drank I couldn't even get buzzed. I couldn't even get buzzed. I'm like this is stupid. And then on like the the day of the wedding um it I just burned through my my resources. My liver was just like we're done. And uh and I and I ended up getting quite drunk and um more a lot more than I meant to and um and I was came as an after effect. You woke up the next day wasted. Well, I was actually okay. I wasn't even like hung over the next day. It was just um I I think I just burned through the enzymes in my liver. Like you have certain liver enzymes that break down alcohol. And so like I think I just I just wore them out. Just like just burned through them. They gave up. And yeah, so I beat the game, you know, it was a game of attrition, you know, and so I just sort of sort of wore it down and finally got got drunk. And even though I was not trying to on that day, you know, I was just I was just drinking at the pace I've been drinking at for the last 3 days and not been had a problem at all. And then yeah, you know, it it actually hit me a lot more. But yeah, now it's a lot a lot um a lot less than that. But you know, I noticed it for a month. And so, you know, something has to be worth losing a month of me feeling optimal. Now, I still felt better than everybody else. I'm still doing 16 sets of of of weights at the gym. No one else is doing that, you know. So, still I'm still I'm not back down at the level that I was before when I was eating, you know, um a clean omnivorous diet. And I'm certainly not on the level of anybody else at the gym. But, um but it it wasn't right for me. And I was just like I noticed it. And so, because you have you Yeah, exactly. you have, you know, quite a, you know, healthy, active lifestyle, you you'd probably notice that as well. And so, you know, pay attention for that, you know, and and if you do drink, you know, keep it keep it clean, you know, clear liquors and and um you know, with a soda or something like that. And uh and and then have a think about that and be like like, you know, yeah, how is this affecting my energy levels? How is this affecting my mental health? How is this affecting my sleep and my performance and my and my gym sessions? Because you you'll probably notice a big difference. That's good advice. I'm gonna pay attention. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Well, Joy, it has been an absolute pleasure. I had had such a fun time talking to you. I'm really glad you came on and thank you so much for taking the time out and uh and yeah, and and dealing with my very poor timekeeping skills. Had some problems. We had to reschedu this like 45 times, you guys. Dr. Sh. 42. I mean, 42. Who's counting like your squats? Nobody's counting. Just squatting, you know. Yeah. 42 sets of squats, 42 sets of changing of point. Exactly. There's a theme there. I want to do your workouts. I'm going to be we're going to check back in after I have like six months of carnivore and I'll be like, "Yes, I did your workout." Yeah. Well, you could do it now. I mean, you you got most of this stuff out of your system. Like, you'll see. You'll see. I mean, and especially if you've been working out a lot, you know, you're not you're not coming into this, you know, and and as a beginner that you're you you're going to do something wrong and hurt yourself. As long as as long as you're you're giving yourself, you know, a bit of a rest and you your body will recover so quickly and you just keep going and keep going and keep going and keep going. I love that. Yes. Awesome. Thank you, doctor. This has been awesome. I'm gonna have to have you on my show, too. Oh, I would love to. Yeah. And speaking of which, where can people find you on social media, find your show, find your courses, and everything else? Absolutely. You can go to um joyvillafitness.com. joyvillaffitness.com. I have my ebook, From Stuck to Strong. I detail my faith-based journey, my mindset, some fitness, nutrition advice. And that book is available on Amazon or you can get it for free at joyvillafitness.com. And then also on Instagram, I'm Joyvilla. Um, on YouTube, I'm at the Joyvilla Show, which is my live streaming show every weekday from 9:00 a.m. Eastern. And, uh, let's see what else on Facebook, Joy Villa Music, and I'm a musician. I'm a filmmaker. So, also, if you Google me, you'll be able to find me. I've done a lot of stuff. So, yeah. Very good. Yes. Well, great. Well, we'll put those links down below and uh and hopefully people can find you there. And hopefully people do. Um, it's been an absolute pleasure and hopefully we can do it again very soon. Thank you so much. Thank you. Great. And thank you everyone for watching. Hopefully you enjoyed that. Uh let us know what you think about that conversation. Obviously farreaching sort of um uh topics and if you think that this could help somebody that you know, please do send it on to them. Thank you very much and we'll see you next time. Hey guys, thank you very much for taking the time out to listen to what I had to say. If you like it, then please like and subscribe to my YouTube channel and podcast. And if you're on YouTube, then please hit that little bell and subscribe, and that'll let you know anytime I have a new video out, which should be every week, if not more. And if you could share this with your friends, that would help me get the word out and let me know that you like what I'm doing. Thanks again, guys.